Earnings call transcript: Ayvens SA Q1 2025 sees strong income growth

Ayvens SA reported a solid start to 2025 with a notable increase in net income and improved operational efficiencies. Despite a slight pre-market dip of 0.28% in its stock price, the company’s financial performance showed resilience. The earnings call highlighted a 21% year-over-year growth in net income to 220 million euros, alongside a reduced cost-income ratio, now at 58%. The company, with a market capitalization of $8.2 billion, has demonstrated strong momentum with a 52.6% return over the past year. According to InvestingPro analysis, Ayvens is currently trading slightly below its Fair Value, suggesting potential upside opportunity.

Key Takeaways

• Net income rose 21% year-over-year, reaching 220 million euros.
• Cost-income ratio improved significantly, dropping 10 percentage points to 58%.
• Expanded partnerships with major automotive players, including BYD and Care by Volvo.
• Stock price saw a minor pre-market decline of 0.28%.

Company Performance

Ayvens SA demonstrated strong financial results in the first quarter of 2025, with a 3% increase in gross operating income to 782 million euros. The company’s return on tangible equity (RoTE) improved to 11%, compared to 9.4% in the previous quarter. This performance indicates a robust recovery and strategic efficiency improvements.

Financial Highlights

• Gross operating income: 782 million euros, up 3% YoY
• Net income group share: 220 million euros, up 21% YoY
• Return on Tangible Equity (RoTE): 11%, up from 9.4% in Q4 2024
• Cost-income ratio: 58%, down 10 percentage points YoY

Outlook & Guidance

Ayvens SA is targeting profitable growth throughout 2025, focusing on expanding its multi-cycle lease offerings and maintaining a 30% electric vehicle (EV) fleet penetration. The company expects to achieve the upper end of its previous guidance for used car sales, ranging from 700 to 1,100 euros per unit. With impressive revenue growth of 35.2% and an overall "GOOD" financial health score from InvestingPro, the company appears well-positioned to execute its growth strategy. Detailed analysis and comprehensive financial metrics are available in the Pro Research Report, offering investors deeper insights into Ayvens’ market position and growth trajectory.

Executive Commentary

CEO Tim Albertson stated, "We have started the year on a very positive note by delivering strong financial results across the board." He emphasized the company’s commitment to the EV transition, highlighting the European Commission’s continued push for electrification targets. CFO Patrick Sommelet added, "We are working hard to sell more to our clients," underscoring the company’s focus on expanding its customer base.

Risks and Challenges

• Ongoing integration processes, with legal mergers and IT migrations still pending in several countries.
• Potential volatility in the used car market as it gradually normalizes.
• The need to maintain competitiveness amidst growing EV market stabilization and ICE car performance.

Q&A

During the earnings call, analysts inquired about the potential distribution of excess capital and the sustainability of current margins. Management confirmed their focus on maintaining margin flexibility and reiterated their commitment to the EV transition, addressing concerns about used car sales market normalization.

Full transcript - Ayvens SA (AYV) Q1 2025:

Conference Moderator: Ladies and gentlemen, thank you to AVEN’s First Quarter twenty twenty five Results Conference Call. Today’s speaker will be Tim Albertson, CEO and Patrick Sommelet, Deputy CEO and CFO. I now hand over to Mr. Tim Albertson. Sir, please go ahead.

Tim Albertson, CEO, AVENS: Thank you. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to this AVENS Q1 twenty twenty five results call. I’m hosting the call with Patrick Sommelet. First, as always, I’ll present the highlights of Q1 and then Patrick will comment on our financial results. And then we’ll be able to take your questions.

Let’s go straight to slide five on the key takeaways. Havens has started the year on a very positive note by delivering strong financial results across the board for the first quarter, showing a continued improvement on all financials, both revenues and costs. Starting with the revenues, margins have increased steadily both versus Q1 twenty twenty four and versus Q4 twenty twenty four, reflected in margins representing five sixty two bps of average earning assets over the quarter. On used car sales, our results and depreciation adjustments reflect again a very gradual normalization with results per unit before depreciation adjustments at $12.29 euros so less than €40 below Q4 twenty twenty four and above our 2025 full year guidance ranging between €700 and €1,100 Our used car sales results also reflects the declining impact of depreciation adjustments. PPA on the lease assets being now fully amortized and the release of prospective depreciation reducing progressively versus previous quarters.

Overall, the used car sales results and depreciation adjustment per unit stood at $7.00 €3 up versus €689 in Q1 twenty twenty four and €239 in Q4 twenty twenty four. These strong revenues combined with lower costs resulted in a costincome ratio of 58%, almost down 10 percentage points versus Q1 twenty twenty four and down two percentage points versus Q4 twenty twenty four. As a result, our net income group shares strongly grew by 21% at two twenty million euros in Q1 twenty twenty five corresponding to an RoTE of 11% versus 9.4% in Q4 twenty twenty four. On the balance sheet, as anticipated, our core Tier one ratio at 13.2% as of March ’25 shows an increase versus December 24, thanks to the application of the CR3 since the beginning of the year. On this capital markets, we issued €1,000,000,000 worth of bonds in February at a competitive price showing once again the strong appetite of debt investors for our bonds.

Let’s now turn to the next page on fleet and earning assets. Our earning assets grew by €800,000,000 versus March 24, reaching €53,500,000,000 at the March 2025, representing an increase of 1.4% year on year. Over the same period, total contracts were down 3.8%, reaching 3,250,000 units at the March ’25. This variation reflects our strong focus on profitability in 2024, which led to an in-depth reshaping of our portfolio. We proactively selected our best clients and partners to develop our portfolio going forward.

This has led to some de fleeting in The UK where we are restructuring our business footprint, notably in the retail segment, in Germany in particular on the subscription market and overall in Turkey. Excluding these three markets, the decrease in fleet is limited to 1.6%. In line with our strategic priorities for ’25, we have launched a series of actions to initiate commercial momentum towards profitable growth, which I will detail in a few minutes. These actions will take a few quarters to deliver due to the usual time lag in our industry between commercial wins and effective deliveries of new cars. As regards to the powertrain dynamics supporting our earning assets growth, EV penetration in terms of car deliveries stood at 41% in Q1 twenty five, stable versus full year ’24.

The battery EV penetration at 30% and plug in hybrids penetration at 11%. Let me now turn to page seven to give an update on our integration. AVENS has continued to deliver on its integration and transformational journey at a high pace. With operating entities having completed their legal mergers and IT migrations in four additional countries since our Q4 twenty twenty four call in February. Migrations have now been completed in 11 countries out of 21 overlapping locations.

As of today, more than half of the group’s total fleet is managed on one single IT platform per country. The graph on the right hand side of the slide shows some KPIs in the overlapping countries demonstrating further strong progress of integration. 58% of these entities have been relocated to single offices in each country. 90% of them have completed the transfer of insurance contracts to their target scheme and supplier terms have been aligned in 95% of them. Besides following the approval of our works councils on the group restructuring, AVENS has now started to implement its target operating model for all corporate functions and IT activities, making our organization leaner, simpler, and more efficient going forward.

As a result of this outstanding execution, synergies have accelerated in line with our plans, both on revenues and operating expenses, reaching €61,000,000 in Q1 twenty twenty five, of which €42,000,000 in revenues and EUR19 million in operating expenses. This compares to a total of EUR20 million in Q1 twenty twenty four and EUR41 million in Q4 twenty twenty four. Let’s now turn to the next page on our plan to build a sustainable and profitable growth path. After reshaping our portfolio in 2024, resuming fleet growth in 2025 with adequate profitability is a key priority for our group. To do so, we have launched a series of commercial initiatives in order to build a path to a sustainable and profitable growth, addressing all client segments with a specific and adaptive approach while monitoring closely our asset risk.

The last corporates, which represents the core of our commercial franchise, we are leveraging our outstanding product range, digital capabilities, global footprint at scale to onboard new volumes and clients. Our efforts have proved quite successful so far, aiming to record several promising wins since the beginning of the year: the building post, Constructural, Ferrero and Veolia, to name just a few. On the retail segments, we are targeting private individuals and micro SMEs through direct campaigns in selected countries or through our partnerships with 18 OEMs. In Q1 twenty five, we notably expanded our partnership with BYD to seven additional countries now covering 11 countries in total and we signed a deal with Care by Volvo, which is the result of which will result in onboarding around 3,500 vehicles in our fleet starting in Q2 twenty twenty five. To support this approach with our customers, we plan to scale and expand products with the best prospect in terms of growth and returns, namely multi cycle lease, light commercial vehicles, as well as growing our insurance penetration.

In the context of EV transition, Multicycle Lease is a strategic product for AEP. Thanks to Multicycle Lease, we are extending our reach to the global public with an affordable mobility offer and at the same time we continue to generate revenues and reduce residual value risk by keeping vehicles longer in our balance sheet. LCVs, notably thanks to e commerce and last mile delivery is a fast growing market where AVENS is well positioned. A good example is the financial partnership we signed in Q1 twenty twenty five with the European Investment Bank for a €350,000,000 credit envelope which will help us to roll out close to 20,000 electric LCVs within the next three years showing our continued commitment to this segment. Lastly, insurance is another profitable growth driver.

Our fully fledged insurance company, Avis Insurance, supports this growth of our service markets. All these actions contributed to stabilizing our order book and improving our order intake, showing a commercial momentum that will materialize in the second half of the year. Let me now hand over to Patrik to comment on our strong Q1 twenty twenty five financial performance.

Patrick Sommelet, Deputy CEO and CFO, AVENS: Thank you, Tim, and good morning to all. I will start with a few words on our revenues on Slide 10. Gross operating income reached million in Q1 twenty twenty five, an increase of more than 3% compared to Q1 twenty twenty four and close to 15% versus Q4 twenty twenty four. This increase has been supported both by growing margins at EUR $7.00 8,000,000 in Q1 twenty twenty five, the highest level since the acquisition of Cliffsplain and also by higher UCS results and depreciation adjustment at EUR 111,000,000, up EUR 6,000,000 versus Q1 twenty twenty four and up EUR 73,000,000 versus Q4 twenty twenty four. If we look at the graph in the middle, underlying margins increased sharply versus Q1 twenty twenty four, up EUR 69,000,000.

This increase was partially offset by the variation in non recurring items. Indeed, non recurring items amounted to minus €44,000,000 Q1 20 20 5, plus €5,000,000 versus Q1 twenty twenty four, mainly attributable this quarter again to hyperinflation. Now looking at the right hand side of the slide, on UCF’s results and depreciation adjustments, euros 111,000,000 in Q1 twenty twenty five results from both a very gradual normalization of used car market prices and lower depreciation adjustments. I will come back to this in a few minutes. On the next page for margin, underlying margin stood at five sixty two basis points of net earning assets in Q1 twenty twenty five in continuation of the increasing trends seen in the previous quarters.

This improvement is driven by our actions to restore profitability and is supported by the ramp up in revenue synergies from €20,000,000 in Q1 twenty twenty four to €42,000,000 for revenue synergies in Q1 twenty twenty five. These synergies are in line with our integration and financial roadmap that we’ve done from better procurement conditions and increasing insurance and short term rental revenues. Total margins stood at $7.00 €8,000,000 up €19,000,000 versus Q1 twenty four. They were negatively impacted by non recurring items as we said, and this shift is in nonrecurring items. The shift is mainly explained by our penetration in Turkey this quarter.

On the next page for UCS and depreciation adjustment results, So even Q1 twenty twenty five UCS results and depreciation adjustment reached €111,000,000 This is €6,000,000 higher than Q1 twenty twenty four, euros ’70 ’3 million higher than Q4 twenty twenty four. We observed a slowing normalization of the UTS market in Q1 twenty twenty five with stabilized UTS results across all proteins including electrical vehicles. In parallel, depreciation adjustment decreased by EUR 64,000,000 versus Q1 twenty twenty four and EUR 79,000,000 versus Q4 twenty twenty four. Volume of car sold was up at 157,000 units versus 152,000 in Q1 twenty twenty four and broadly stable versus Q4 ’twenty four. Looking at the graph on the left, UCS results per unit stood at €12.29 in Q1 ’twenty five versus €16.61 in Q1 ’twenty four.

And compared to Q4 twenty twenty four, the result per unit is normalizing very gradually, the decrease being limited to €38 per vehicle. At the bottom right of the slide, you can see that depreciation adjustment amounted to minus EUR83 million in Q1 twenty twenty five versus minus EUR147 million in Q1 twenty twenty four. In detail, PPA impact amounted to minus €28,000,000 in Q1 twenty twenty five versus minus €75,000,000 in Q1 twenty twenty four. And the release of prospective depreciation amounted to minus €55,000,000 versus minus 72 in Q1 twenty twenty four. The PPA of lead assets is now fully amortized and as a result, there won’t be any negative impact in the coming quarters.

The indicative future impact of prospective depreciation relief is available in appendices on slide 17. As a result of slowly normalizing used car market prices and progressively decreasing depreciation adjustments, you see that depreciation adjustment per unit reached $7.00 €3 in Q1 twenty twenty five versus €689 in Q1 twenty twenty four and €239 in Q4 twenty twenty four. Let’s now turn to the next page for operating expenses. So total operating expenses are trending down, showing a decrease of minus €17,000,000 compared to Q1 ’twenty four. If we look at underlying costs, are down EUR 26,000,000 year on year, thanks to our continued participation across the board.

Compared to Q4 twenty twenty four, operating expenses are up €2,000,000 but Q1 twenty twenty five figures include a €7,000,000 charge for annual business taxes, which were fully accounted for in Q1 twenty twenty five as prescribed by IFRIC 2021, fully accounted for in Q1 for the full year 2025. Adjusted for it, underlying costs would be down by €5,000,000 versus Q4 twenty twenty four. Cost to achieve amounted to €36,000,000 versus 27,000,000 in Q1 twenty twenty four and in line with plans. As a reminder, our guidance for the full year CTA is between 115,000,000 and 125 Combined with higher margins, these lower operating expenses generated strong positive jaws with a cost income at 58%, down roughly 10 percentage points versus 51.24. Let us now turn to the next page for the rest of the income statement.

First on cost of risk. So the cost of risk decreased by €2,000,000 versus Q1 twenty twenty four at €31,000,000 or 23 basis points of average earning assets. Not much to comment on this item, which is in line with previous quarter on our expectations. Q4 twenty twenty four was a bit elevated due to a few one offs that we indicated previously. Profit before tax is up 12.5% versus Q1 twenty twenty four at $316,000,000 as a result of increasing margin and used car sales results, lower operating expense and a lower cost of risk this quarter.

Effective tax rate stands at 30%. This is in line with indications for the year. And the net income group share is currently up at €220,000,000 an increase of 21% versus Q1 twenty twenty four and thirty eight percent versus Q4. On the final slide, we comment on RWA. So as indicated previously, we benefit this quarter from strong decrease in operational risk charge leading to a minus $3,400,000,000 lower RWA for this risk.

This is partially offset by an increase of €1,000,000,000 RWA due to off balance sheet items linked to the other group guaranteed on forward deposits. And again, this is at least very largely due to the application of TR3. And we received CET1 capital at EUR7.5 billion at the March ’25. Our CET1 ratio stands at 13.2%. This concludes our presentation.

Thank you for listening. We are now ready to take any questions you may have.

Conference Moderator: Thank you. The first question is from Sharap Kumar of Deutsche Bank. Please go ahead.

Sharap Kumar, Analyst, Deutsche Bank: Good morning. Thank you for taking my questions. So I have three, please. First one is on margins. I wanted to understand the sustainability of your strong leasing and service margins.

Five sixty two basis points is quite above your guidance. So should we expect some softness going forward, especially in the second half when volumes are expected to pick up? So, basically, how should we think about the margin evolution from here and moving parts? That’s the first one. The second one is on the used car sale result trends.

Obviously, encouraging results, but how do you see the market evolving, particularly in the context of any second order impacts that you see on the residual values from auto tariffs? And the final one is on capital. CET1 quite healthy at 13.2. You know, how should we think about your excess capital? Should we expect any extraordinary distributions in the near future?

Is this contingent on any events like, say, clarity on The UK motor finance provisions? Thank you.

Tim Albertson, CEO, AVENS: Thank you, Shahad. Let me take your two last questions first, and then I’ll hand over to Patrik to give you an input on the margins. So I think on the capital, you’re right. We do have excess capital compared to our targets. And as we have said in the past calls, we do not anticipate to keep that.

Now we will propose to our board during the year exactly what to do and in what form it will happen. But obviously we have said we will be above 12% of core Tier one. We expect to trend around 12.5%, twelve point six %. So anything above that would be a difficult for a potential period. On the used car sales, I think what we see in the market is pretty much what we have seen in the past quarters that the ICE cars are trending better than anticipated, so they are holding up better.

It’s really around supply and demand. And on the EVs, what we have seen in the last probably two quarters is that they are stabilizing, still doing losses on the ones that we have been putting on the books until mid last year, but obviously stabilizing and in some countries actually improving slightly. There are some markets that is still trending at very high losses, but overall stabilizing and we do not necessarily see that that will change dramatically over the year, the coming quarters. I think what think Patrick already mentioned, you know that obviously the PPA exercise or impact will actually disappear from Q2 and onwards. And of course, the prospective depreciation will also actually decrease going forward.

So the markets are holding up quite well. There’s actually good demand for used cars and in particular for our cars, which is typically three, four, five years old in a very good quality. And we still expect the normalization to happen, but probably at a bit slower pace than what’s the On the margin, Patrick?

Patrick Sommelet, Deputy CEO and CFO, AVENS: Yes, thank you. On the margin, it’s the five sixty two basis points is a bit higher than the number we were expecting. Again, we have no guidance, no formal guidance on this number per quarter because it’s difficult to monitor with this level of precision. What is good this quarter is the level of the various components of the service margin across the board and all its various components are holding well. It’s coming from both insurance revenues, which are benefiting from slightly better damage ratios in some countries, Also coming from R and D, repair, maintenance and diodes provisioning, which is also now starts to be better priced in the contract and the costs have been leveling down a bit.

The short term rentals revenues are also roughly stable and the others as well. So it’s across the board quite a decent performance in terms of service provided to our clients. It’s also the whole lot of the synergy, which is taking probably some effects. So a good quarter is not a guarantee that we’ll be at these levels in each quarter, but let’s say we are working hard to sell more to our clients.

Sharap Kumar, Analyst, Deutsche Bank: Thank you for that.

Conference Moderator: The next question is from Kiri Vijayarajah of HSBC CIB. Please go ahead.

Kiri Vijayarajah, Analyst, HSBC CIB: Yes, sir. Good morning, everyone. A couple of questions, if I may. Firstly, can I just come back to the excess capital question and specifically, how does the regulator view your UK motor finance exposure? I mean, do they need to see some clarity there before letting you make additional capital return beyond that 50% payout ratio target?

So, is UK Motor Finance a bit of a roadblock or not in your discussion with the regulators? And then secondly, a high level question in the context of this kind of greater appetite to use taxpayer money to drive growth and investment in Europe. I just wondered where do company car EV schemes fit into that? Could we see more subsidies in that direction? I know there’s been some talk.

Or is it maybe more the opposite that political priorities are rather moving away from electrification targets? So just, you know, your kind of high level thoughts on how you see that evolving in Europe, please. Thank you.

Tim Albertson, CEO, AVENS: Yeah. Thanks. Thanks, Kiri. So I think on the on on on The UK situation as you know, the first hearings took place in April, early April. And we anticipate obviously whether it’s a verdict probably July, August, September we would anticipate to have full clarity on that.

And it’s fair to say that, you know, at this point, you know, we have not discussed with the regulator around our excess capital and The UK case. Clearly we want to have ourselves, you know, kind of certainty for where that case is going. As we’ve said many times, we feel adequately provisioned with what we got and we’ll say the outcome of the first hearings have not changed our view on that, but before that case is somehow concluded, it’s probably fair to say that we would not necessarily believe it directly to our board with the proposal for excess capital. On the EV targets, so I think our feeling is, and you know, we’re actually very close to Brussels spending some time trying to lobbying also our interest in what’s going on in terms of the extrication mandates and all the other things that is on the table. The European Commission do not look like they want to give up the targets for electrification.

I think the overall, I would say the overall speech is that they want to see electrification in Europe, that they have obviously lightened up a bit the cafe rules to give the manufacturers a bit better time to get aligned with expectations. What we see from our clients, especially our big corporate clients, they have not walked away at least at this point from wanting to also liquefy their fleets. So we are not seeing any changes there as such. I think what we have seen in the first quarter and maybe coming back to a potential question around the volumes, there has been quite some fiscal changes in France and in particular Italy around benefit in time for company cars, which has actually slowed down some decisions on renewals or getting new cars in. That is more or less behind us.

We start seeing that these large clients is now back, have readjusted their car policies and then is moving on. So we don’t see a big change there as such in terms of electrification. And as you saw, we are still at a high pace of 30% of EVs coming into the fleet. So we have not seen a reduced appetite for that at this point. Clearly the regulators seem to be pushing us.

Julien Onion, Analyst, Stifel: Great, very helpful. Thank you guys.

Conference Moderator: The next question is from Julien Onion of Stifel. Please go ahead.

Julien Onion, Analyst, Stifel: Yes, hi. Good morning. Just like to come back a bit with the guidance of 25,000,000 in particular, the UCS. For the full year when you publish your results, you target between €700 and €1,100 per unit, which is obviously, which Q1 is much higher with 1,200 and you have not guide anymore, not repeat the guidance officially in the quarterly. And you mentioned, but you just mentioned, by the way, that the used car market is stabilizing even some markets like Germany are up, for instance, in terms of pricing, which means that effectively, we should remain close probably to the 1,200.

So why have you not revised your guidance officially on this aspect? Or maybe you have not, and so it’s why you have not disclosed any guidance to want to see one quarter more before eventually revising this guidance? Thank you.

Tim Albertson, CEO, AVENS: Thanks, Julia. I think it’s fair to say that even if things are moving in a nice direction and there seems to be a bit better, let’s say, performing in Q1 here. Know, the electrification and electric vehicles have shown very volatile. So, you know, we and and, you know, we do also anticipate to some extent, you know, the the the ice cars would normalize. You saw they have normalized bit as well in ’24 compared to ’24.

And then, of course, there is, you know, to some extent, the question around the whole global economy with the tariffs and the trade wars that potentially could have some impact. And hence, we don’t think it’s the right time to change our guidance. Potentially, I should say, when we get a bit further down the road and we see that things are moving according to what we’ve seen so far, it might be the time, but not at this point. Think clearly what you can say is that, you know, we, where we are today, I think we’ll probably be in the upper end of the guidance that we’ve been giving.

Julien Onion, Analyst, Stifel: So the guidance is still remaining officially, but it’s not been disclosed again in the press release?

Tim Albertson, CEO, AVENS: Sorry, I didn’t get that, sorry.

Julien Onion, Analyst, Stifel: The guidance is not in the press release, repeat. I mean, it’s not you have not changed the guidance officially, but it’s still the same.

Tim Albertson, CEO, AVENS: Yes, yes. Well, we don’t this is a business update, it’s not forced to change our guidance at this point.

Julien Onion, Analyst, Stifel: Okay, very clear. Thank you very much.

Patrick Sommelet, Deputy CEO and CFO, AVENS: Thank you.

Conference Moderator: The next question is from Geoffroy Michelet of ODDO BHF. Please go ahead.

Geoffroy Michelet, Analyst, ODDO BHF: Yes. Thank you for taking my question. I have one, it is linked to the strong margin that you had, five sixty two basis points. Is it fair to say that it means that you are now at ease enough to be maybe a bit more aggressive, commercially speaking, so that we could potentially see a slight degradation in the coming quarters because you would like to reignite the growth, for instance. Notably we saw that the number of new cars this quarter was a bit weak.

Thank you.

Tim Albertson, CEO, AVENS: Yes. Thank you, Geoffrey. So I think the level of margin we saw in Q1, I think, coming back to a fixed point in a day. Quarter by quarter, it’s it’s it is varying a bit, you know. But, obviously, where we are today with margin gives us some flexibility.

First of all, that at the end of the day if this is the level we are at, we do not necessarily need to grow as much as we would anticipate. But it’s also fair to say that we do think we should start growing again. There is good opportunities to do so, which would also mean that we would probably be a bit more aggressive in pricing and it could have an impact over the remainder of the year in that sense. So I think where we are today, first of all, do not guide on the whole margin. First quarter, I think, was very good.

All the elements of margin were actually performed really well, also based on a lot of actions we have been taking over the last eighteen months. So that gives us a good comfort and it gives us some flexibility I think in the coming quarters to do what we want to do.

Geoffroy Michelet, Analyst, ODDO BHF: Thank you very much.

Conference Moderator: Mr. Albertsens, there are no more questions. Back to you for any closing remarks you may have.

Tim Albertson, CEO, AVENS: Thank you. Well, thank you all for listening and for your questions. So that concludes basically our call today. Our IR department is very happy to answer any questions you may have outside of this call. Thanks a lot, and have a good day.

Thank you. Bye bye.

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