AvePoint at Cantor Fitzgerald Conference: Strategic Growth and Expansion

On Tuesday, 11 March 2025, AvePoint (NASDAQ: AVPT) presented at the Cantor Fitzgerald Global Technology Conference, detailing its strategic evolution and growth prospects. The company underscored its transformation into a comprehensive platform provider, leveraging its strong ties with Microsoft while expanding into multi-cloud environments. Despite positive momentum, challenges remain in sustaining its growth trajectory.

Key Takeaways

• AvePoint aims to reach $1 billion in annual recurring revenue (ARR) within five years.
• Over 90% of ARR is derived from the Microsoft ecosystem, with strategic expansion into Google Workspace.
• The company achieved a record gross retention rate of 89% and targets the low 90s in coming years.
• AvePoint positions itself as a key player in data governance for AI, addressing data control challenges.

Financial Results

• ARR & Growth:

- Over 90% of ARR comes from the Microsoft ecosystem.

- The Control Suite, focused on governance, grew in the high 20s percentages, outpacing overall ARR growth in 2024.

- The company aims to achieve $1 billion in ARR within five years.

• Retention Rates:

- Gross retention rate reached a record high of 89% at year-end.

- The target for GRR is to reach the low 90s in the next couple of years.

Operational Updates

• Product & Platform:

- AvePoint is enhancing its platform to address multiple customer challenges.

- The company is expanding into multi-cloud environments with updates for Google and Salesforce.

- A new selling motion with tiered packages has been introduced for simplified selling.

• Customer Success:

- Implemented a "pooled CS" concept for smaller customers, improving retention rates.

Future Outlook

• Growth Strategy:

- AvePoint focuses on achieving $1 billion in ARR within five years, with M&A playing a significant role.

- Strategic discussions are underway to sell more of the platform.

• M&A Strategy:

- The company is open to acquisitions that support its multi-cloud strategy, expand geographic presence, or bolster its elements platform.

- Larger, transformative acquisitions are being considered to enhance revenue and ARR.

Q&A Highlights

• Competition & Microsoft:

- AvePoint operates as a partner within the Microsoft ecosystem, providing complementary solutions.

• Data Governance & AI:

- The company positions itself as a key player in data governance for AI, addressing the need for accurate and secure data management.

In conclusion, AvePoint’s presentation at the Cantor Fitzgerald Global Technology Conference highlighted its strategic growth initiatives and market opportunities. For a detailed insight, readers are encouraged to refer to the full transcript.

Full transcript - Cantor Fitzgerald Global Technology Conference:

Brett, Analyst: Point, where you guys came from, maybe talk about when you went public, how you came public, and so what has happened maybe over the last couple of years?

Jim, AvPoint: Sure. Great to be here and thanks for having us. So So maybe just thinking about AvPoint, who are we, where we’ve come from. We’re a twenty plus year old company, so not something that just started yesterday. We’re in the data management, data governance space.

I’ll talk about that in a minute. And then to your point, Brett, we went public in ’twenty one. At that time, going public via SPAC was in fashion and was the right thing to do. So we evaluated, we were going down the path of a traditional IPO. And obviously, this was during COVID.

This was no vaccine, no election. So lots of uncertainty. And at the time, obviously, the SPAC sponsors, very well known, respected people behind the SPAC sponsor, was a great opportunity, created certainty. And the outcome was pretty quick. And so we went via SPAC.

Now obviously, fast forward, we go public in July of ’twenty one, SPACs fall out of favor. The whole kind of market collapses from that. I think we got kind of buried with some of that because we actually were performing and we delivered. But I think in the wake of all of that stuff, we kind of got crushed a little bit. And then it’s taken us a while.

But one of the things that we are really proud of is that for the past eight quarters, we’ve really communicated what we were going to do. We’ve set out our expectations, communicated them and then really focused on profitable growth and executing and delivering against the expectations we set. And we feel really good that over the past eight quarters we’ve been able to do that. And we feel good about the future and the prospects. We play in an interesting space, right?

Data governance, data management has now become very popular. Obviously, with all the AI initiatives that are rampant and very popular. I think the data management governance side is more of the blocking and tackling. And for the past twenty years, it wasn’t sexy, only maybe to banks and some other regulated industries was it a must have or a very sexy kind of thing. But now everyone’s talking about it.

Every board meeting, every board conversation is talking about security, governance. How can we enable our teams with AI and still protect the underlying data and make sure we’re not surfacing data to people who shouldn’t see it. That’s the kind of the governance aspect of it. We’re mission critical data is relevant. We’re mission critical data is relevant.

So again, it’s a great time to be in the space. We’re excited. We play in kind of all aspects of the market in terms of enterprise customers, mid market, SMB, which is kind of unique for a company our size. And then we’re also geographically dispersed with about 45% of our ARR in North America, 30 Percent in EMEA and roughly 20%, twenty five % sitting in APAC. So we’re really diverse, dispersed and well balanced.

And I think that positions us really well for the future.

Brett, Analyst: When you maybe take a step back and look at your, I would say, broad product overview, what is your secret sauce? And has that changed over the years? Like have you guys been particularly good in backup or migration? And how has that allowed you to expand into adjacencies from a product perspective?

Jim, AvPoint: Yes, it’s a great question. So I think one of the benefits of Appoint is that we truly have a platform approach. So when you talk about a specific product, a lot of our competitors have a specific product or one product. And I think the competitive advantage we do have is that although we are very good on a point solution competition point of view, whether it’s backup, whether it’s a governance product, whether it’s a storage optimization product, like we compete very well on the individual product. But I think our competitive advantage is that on a platform basis, in other words, you can engage one company, one platform and address multiple challenges that you face.

That definitely gives us a competitive advantage, particularly in times that we’re in now where people are looking to consolidate vendors, they’re looking to maximize their efficiencies. So if you can deal with one vendor that’s addressing multiple challenges that you face, that’s a much more compelling argument than having to employ four or

Brett, Analyst: guys have been throughout your history closely intertwined with Microsoft, which kind of makes sense given how widely adopted they are. I would say like more recently announced some enhanced product updates for whether it be Google or Salesforce kind of expanding into maybe like a multi cloud provider. What does that do to your guys’ business? Obviously, Microsoft is still a massive TAM, if you look at the number of users they have in our ecosystem. But what does some of the recent updates to Google allow for you guys, maybe from a TAM perspective, longer term?

How should we think about it?

Jim, AvPoint: Yes, great question. So I think maybe first and foremost is, you know, we recognize that companies today, whether it’s Kantor or others, are all multi cloud. You know, no one is just working in one ecosystem today, whether that’s you may use Microsoft for your office productivity suites, maybe email, but maybe you’re using Salesforce for your CRM, maybe you’re using even GCP for maybe some of your storage, maybe using AWS. So everyone is multi cloud today. There’s no such thing as just a single use of one hyperscaler or one cloud.

So I think that’s just reality. And I think in our world, you’re right, Microsoft has been a great partner in terms of the ecosystem we play in. It’s 90 plus percent of our ARR today. We expect that going forward, they’re still going to be our dominant partner and that ecosystem, as you said, is massive. We benefit from that ecosystem.

And as you said, is massive. We benefit from that ecosystem. I think we help the ecosystem as well. But you’re right, things like or other ecosystems like Google, we think has a massive opportunity for improvement. The same challenges that we solve for our Microsoft customers, our Google customers are experiencing the same challenges, whether that’s things like you mentioned, whether it’s backing up, whether it’s governance, whether it’s storage optimization, security, all of those same challenges that our Microsoft customers have, the Google customers have.

And so there’s a massive opportunity for us to play in that space. We recently announced right before earnings, a partnership with Google in terms of making our technologies available to that customer base. We’re excited about that opportunity. It’s obviously early innings for us there, but we think there’s a great opportunity for us to accelerate and capture market share in that space as well. And I think you’re right, it just helps us achieve kind of the longer term goals that we’ve set.

And as you know, at our Investor Day, we announced kind of this five year target of getting to $1,000,000,000 of ARR. And I think the Google initiative that we’ve been talking about in that partnership will contribute to us getting to that number.

Brett, Analyst: Is there a different competitive environment, if you’re talking about from one cloud environment to the others with respect to the customers you service?

Jim, AvPoint: Yes, I think so. I mean, if you think about just the environment itself, whether it’s in Microsoft’s case, obviously, they’ve been around a lot longer. There’s just more competitors. It’s a more mature space. If you think of the Google Workspace environment, it’s funny, I was talking to somebody just a few minutes ago.

If you think of the companies that initially were using Google Workspaces, it was startups because it was initially free. It was kind of considered almost like a, okay, you can’t afford Microsoft, so you’re using Google. Now that’s no longer the case. That’s real companies using Google Workspaces as their primary solution. So it’s kind of matured and obviously now it’s a very mature product.

So I think there’s real opportunities. But the competitive landscape in that ecosystem is less than the more mature Microsoft ecosystem. So we do think there’s an opportunity for us to capitalize. You know, this is why the partnership and why Google was excited because we’re bringing technologies that their customer base doesn’t have today. They’re either a lot of homegrown solutions that their customers are utilizing.

And I think they look at what we’ve done with Microsoft and they view it as, hey, this is a real opportunity for you to help our customers, which is only good for and better for them with as they mature their own marketplace, their own ecosystem, this really propels them as well.

Brett, Analyst: I think we’ve ran about a bit that you guys are kind of a picks and shovel play for AI. Maybe like elaborate on that, like for AI to become as ubiquitous and proliferated as many think it could be. You need a lot of governance and somebody to take that unstructured data and get meaning out of it. How are you guys at Pick n Shoppe play? And elaborate maybe just on your view of how AI ultimately helps your business over the short, medium, long term?

Jim, AvPoint: Yes. I mean, picks and shovels, you could pick another acronym or analogy like blocking and tackling, pick one that you like that meets. But I think the premise there is that I think we’re doing the things that are not sexy, right? So it’s the behind the scenes. Somebody was asking me the other day, Jamie and I were talking to this person and they’re like, I’ve never heard of AvePoint.

And it’s like, yeah, you know what, because we’re behind the scenes, right? We’re not customer facing, we’re not obviously it’s B2B and we’re also kind of behind the scenes. We’re not even an end user would have no idea that our technology was supporting them. So that’s kind of the behind the scenes piece or the blocking and tackling and the picks and shovels. Bless you.

But I think that really goes to what we’ve been doing for twenty years. And it’s really that fundamental foundational things that we’re managing that data that now has become really important when you then put AI models or agents sitting on top of that reasoning over that data. It’s the old story, right? If you have garbage in, garbage out. So if the data has a bunch of junk in it, then the results you’re going to get from the AI modeling is also going to be junk.

And whether that’s old obsolete data that should have been archived or destroyed or duplicate copies that should have been cleaned out and has not been, that’s a problem. When we talk about governance, who has access to what? As the CFO of the company, I may have access to certain information. The accounts payable staff person who’s been with the company for a month should not have the same access to data that say the CFO or the CEO does. Yet what we were finding with some of our customers when they were implementing some AI tools, whether it was Copilot or other even chat GPT in their own environment, they were surfacing data that should not have been surfaced.

And that goes to, again, the governance of who has access to what, the permissioning, the tagging of information. And our software allows companies to do that in a very automated fashion so that it’s not manual, but automated flagging those items that are improperly classified or that may create exposure. And therefore they can be remediated before implementing, say, an AI solution and then you’re not surfacing the payroll of everyone in the department or things that we’ve read about in the papers of the incidents that have happened. So I do think it’s important. I do think it’s a nice tailwind for us because I think it’s something that we’ve thought has been very important for the past twenty plus years.

I think now there’s a lot more people who agree with us that it’s it is important. And again, we think it’s kind of the new normal now that people will just assume that their data is their most important asset and needs to be treated as such. I don’t know if

Brett, Analyst: you guys coined the term data estate, but I like I know you guys said it and I like it.

Jim, AvPoint: I think that might have been James. I think he created that one. But it is a very good term.

Brett, Analyst: If you look across your customer base, like to what extent do you feel like what percentage of your customers do you think have good control over the data estate? Or maybe just in your TAM, what trends are you seeing of people like coming to just reason that we actually need to step on the gas here?

Jim, AvPoint: I think I’m not going to get the quote right, but there is a stat we have. I don’t think it’s in our investor deck, but that there was like a CIO survey that talked about your confidence in your data, essentially the question you’re asking. And the percentage was abysmally low. I want to say like in the 20% of the confidence that we have control of our data. And so and that’s coming from the people in charge of the responsibility, right?

So that’s a pretty bad statistic in terms of if we think about just where the where we live as a society in terms of businesses that our IT groups would not be thinking they have control over their data. So I think that’s bad in terms of how we think about it as companies. I think that’s good for companies like us, because I do think that again puts a spotlight on the need for better management of the data and better security of that data. And that doesn’t even talk about all the hacks and ransomware attacks and all of that stuff where you really need to be protected. We’re talking about just your own people surfacing data that they shouldn’t be surfacing.

So the protection and the governance over that is really important. But and then obviously, you have all the security concerns from external threats and even just obviously your own employees not taking the proper care and then exposing the company yes, I mean, it’s I think overall, even within our customer base, there’s still huge opportunities, which has led to really some nice NRR growth for us over the past two years, all time record highs in NRR growth this past year. So I think that’s all coming from number one, we have a platform that people can consume more and more products as they face their additional challenges. I think that’s been really good for us. And like you said, I think it’s just a heightened awareness that people are seeing the challenges.

And fortunately, we’re in a position to be able to help them. And I was just going

Jamie, AvPoint: to say, I think more recently with some of our new customer adds and expansions, we’ve probably done a better job with what you’re talking about, Brett, in terms of selling more of the platform. I think if you look back even just a few years ago, it would be very common to just start with like a migration offering or just backup and sort of these tactical use cases that we could address. But with all the themes that I think Jim has been talking about, you’ve seen a lot more of the strategic discussions taking place where we’re selling more of the platform. So like in 2024, our control suite, which is where our governance products sit, was our fastest growing suite and actually grew kind of high 20s percentages, so outpacing the overall ARR growth. And resilience is sort of right behind it, which is our backup and storage optimization play.

And so we’re seeing a lot more of those new customers starting with those. And then the other thing that we talked about at our Investor Day last week were some new packages that we’re rolling out to sort of simplify the selling process specific for those two suites as well, which we think is really going to be helpful, I think, with a starting point for customers. There’s three tiers within each suite. So our reps I think can very nicely sell and address the use cases that customers are telling us they really care the most about. And then it also kind of provides a natural map to upsell them to the higher tiers of offerings over time.

So I think we’re seeing better adoption from new customers and better expansion trends. And that’s really, I think, driven by the overall demand for our platform and some of these dynamics that we’ve been talking about.

Brett, Analyst: Could you just compare the new selling motion with the tiers to what you had previously? Yes. Well, I

Jamie, AvPoint: mean, I think well, first of all, the packages are brand new. We’re just rolling them out. But I think it’s really just a simpler way of bundling or packaging them and sort of, again, having the discussion be much more around, you know, these use cases and the capabilities that we can offer as opposed to just saying, you know, we can migrate your data from on prem to the cloud or, you know, from from one cloud to another. Because I think that kind of dilutes the power of our platform offering. And when we sort of, I think, phrase the conversation this way, it’s resonating a lot more with these buyers because these are really kind of top of mind problems that they can’t really, I think, ignore anymore.

Brett, Analyst: I would say across, I would say, the tech space, software space, SaaS space, there’s not a lot of companies I think ended the year with record high NRR and gross retention as well. Is that could you just give more color to that? Is that coming off a lower base? Is that because like you’re just seeing a shift in patterns from your customers? Is demand really just reflecting materially higher?

Jim, AvPoint: Yes, I mean, it’s a great question. So maybe starting with gross retention rate, because when we think about NRR, obviously, first and foremost is GRR. So if your GRR is strong and improving, it should have a positive impact on your NRR. It’s a good base to start. So one of the key things we really have been focused on over the past couple of years is how do we improve our GRR.

And you’ve seen over the past really three or four years a steady improvement in that GRR. And obviously, we ended this year at 89%, which was a record high for us. And again, we’re really focused on improving that. We think that gets into the low 90s here in the next couple of years. So we feel really good about the progress we’ve made in GRR.

And that’s really a combination of focus, number one, but also resourcing, making sure we’re properly resourced to support our customer base. And then secondly is technologies, investing in technologies both within the platform in terms of really the telemetry of the product to understand how our customers are using the product or more importantly, how they’re not using the product that we can come in and really give them advice in terms of how do they maximize the value of the platform. And then external tools as well to really understand our customer usage and where they’re at in the platform. And then what we did this year, really starting in ’twenty four was really looked at a concept that we’ve called pooled CS, which would be if you think about customer success, for us, there’s a dedicated CS person for every customer above a certain dollar amount. And then below that, there’s no dedicated CS.

So in the past, that group had a very low retention rate, as you would imagine. So what we focused on was individually, they’re not material customers, right, from a financial point of view. But in the aggregate, that cohort is still a significant population. And so we really focused on a pooled CS concept, which was not dedicated, but still support. And then looking at our digital assets to support that group.

And what we’ve seen really starting in Q3 of ’twenty four was an improvement in that cohort base in terms of their retention rate and then a further improvement in Q4, both of which helped us kind of accelerate the GRR to record high levels. So again, we’re continuing to invest in that part of the business. So that’s our GRR story. And then on the NRR, obviously, it starts with GRR. But then as Jamie referred to, this platform play that we do have is really a key because if you think of most of our products are licensed on a seat count basis.

So we’re not really getting expansion by selling more seats. There are cases where customers are adding employees and we’re obviously adding more seats. That happens for sure. But the bulk of it is coming from the bulk of our upsell is coming from them buying additional products within the platform. So as Jamie said, maybe they’re buying something from our control suite, which maybe is governance.

And then maybe they expand to the resilience suite, which might include one of our backup products or a storage optimization product. So by consuming more of the platform, they’re expanding their spend with us and obviously that’s improving the NRR. Awesome.

Brett, Analyst: I want to touch on M and A and kind of capital allocation. You guys have been somewhat acquisitive, most recently the Widenik acquisition. Can you just maybe talk about how you guys view capital allocation? You have a ton of cash in the balance well, not a ton, a lot of cash in the balance sheet. You’re buying back shares.

You’re making acquisitions. So like what is priority number one for you guys?

Jim, AvPoint: Great question. So we think about capital allocations really in three components or three pillars as we refer to them. The first is obviously investing in the business. So first and foremost, we want to ensure that we’re investing in our development teams, we’re investing in the rest of the organization to make sure that they have the resourcing, they have the tools, they have the technologies that they need to be successful and help us continue to grow and support our customers. So that’s first and foremost.

So we want to make sure we do that. Then second is we believe that M and A is a vital strategy for us to continue to grow and take advantage of the market we’re in. So as you mentioned, we’ve done six, what I would call tuck in acquisitions to date, so very small. I would consider them more like technology acquisitions. So not really driving revenue or ARR per se, but nice tuck in technology acquisitions that we believe then plugged into our platform provide more value to our customer base and maybe even expand that customer base.

But they’ve been relatively small. I think when we look at now 25, I think we’re in a position where we believe we can actually do more transformative M and A or at least larger M and A. We’ve kind of cut our teeth on these six. We think we’ve integrated them really well. We’ve executed and we feel comfortable now and more confident that we can execute on larger opportunities.

If you think about it, we went public. We had never done an acquisition before. So it was only a couple of years ago You want to ensure that the integration of whatever you’re acquiring is as smooth as possible. Most acquisitions fail right after it’s the implementation, it’s not in the deal structure or that the deal was structured improperly. It’s the integration of the organization.

So I think we’ve done a great job on the six that we’ve done so far. I think we’ve got a muscle and an experience now to be able to take on bigger opportunities. So that’s the second kind of capital allocation. And then the third allocation for us has been just thinking about share repurchases, where it’s an opportunity for us to continue to keep the share count as not dilutive as possible in terms of obviously we’re mindful of that. And if there’s an opportunity for us to put some capital to work in terms of repurchasing shares, we’ll do that.

We’ve done that in the past. We have a program in place and so a share repurchase program in place. And so as the opportunity arises, we’ll be in a position to repurchase shares. And for us, that’s really the third leg of that stool in terms of capital allocation. And again, we feel that all three are very important.

And I would say probably leaning more on the first two than the third, but again, we’ll utilize all three as necessary.

Brett, Analyst: If previous acquisitions have been kind of tech focused, I’m not saying that the next acquisitions would be to buy revenues, but what would you look for in a bigger acquisition? Could you be more specific as to what product exposure you might not have now that you would want or what you would see that acquisition looking like? And how big are we talking about?

Jim, AvPoint: Yes. So again, really good question. I think when we think about acquisitions going forward, I think they could fall into maybe three different categories or priorities. One would be, we’ve talked a lot about multi cloud. So I think as we think about acquisitions, if they support our multi cloud strategy and would help propel that forward, I think that could be a nice opportunity to supplement what we’re currently doing organically.

The second would be even geographically. We’ve talked a lot that we have a great presence in North America. It’s growing very nicely. EMEA is very strong. And even APAC, probably our fastest growing market, also very strong.

But we have very little presence in South America, Latin America. I think there’s opportunities there as those countries develop and continue to mature. I think there’s an opportunity for us to play there. And then even areas like India, which historically has been an exporter of technology. I think they’re now starting to become more of a consumer as well of technology.

And I think there’s an opportunity for us to play in that marketplace, where in the past we wouldn’t have. And so again, that’s an untapped market for us. We think there’s opportunities there. So I think geography is like the second opportunity for us. So first would be multi cloud, second would be geography.

And then the third, similar to this Identiq acquisition we just did in terms of the MSP space that we’re playing in, We think there’s an opportunity to continue to look at technologies in that space that bolster our elements platform, which is specifically targeted and focused for the MSP community. We think there’s an opportunity to support that and in turn support our MSP customers. That’s a huge growth area for us, has been over the past couple of years. We expect that to continue to be a significant growth area. And so I think supporting that with potential acquisitions of technology, I think could be a nice support structure.

And you’re right, I think to date they’ve all been technology focused. I do think the size could be larger. Our ticket size to date, I think our largest acquisition was from a purchase price size, a little less than $20,000,000 I do think we have appetite for significantly larger than that. And I think you’re right, if you’re spending more than the actual revenue or ARR associated will be more. So I think those next opportunities we look at will probably have a more accretive impact on both revenue and ARR as opposed to just the technology acquisition.

Brett, Analyst: On your path to $1,000,000,000 to what extent is M and A playing a key role in there?

Jim, AvPoint: Great question. When we laid out the plan and it’s funny, we were I don’t know if we talked about this, but we were talking about internally, we’ve been talking about this $1,000,000,000 target for months. And so the question came up is, should we at our Investor Day make this internal target a public target? And so there’s some debate back and forth because arguably pretty aspirational, People generally aren’t committing a five year target. And so we felt like, well, we already have it as a North Star internally.

We might as well make it an external target as well and hold ourselves accountable. So we put it out there. Now when we do that, we look at that almost geographically focused as well in terms of working with our North America team, our EMEA team and APAC team and talking about their individual goals of how they’re going to get us to the $1,000,000,000 Like each one, each of those groups has their own component that helps us get there. And so that’s been really rewarding in terms of the accountability that each of those teams has stepped up and taken. So that’s really good.

So we feel pretty good that even those groups have a really good chance to get to the $1,000,000,000 without any M and A activity. However, having said that, we do think M and A will play a part in contributing to that target. How much we really haven’t specifically laid out. So I think it does two things. M and A, I think those two things depending on the size.

Either helps us attain the goal or it helps us attain it faster. So I think either one of those is a real positive in terms of achieving the goal.

Brett, Analyst: And maybe just lastly, if you had to say there was one misconception about your stock, what do you think it would be?

Jim, AvPoint: Yes, that’s a really good question. It’s interesting. I would have said

Brett, Analyst: I’ll offer my opinion. I think we get a lot of people asking if Microsoft is going to co compete with

Jim, AvPoint: you guys. That’s a great question. We’ve been answering that question for twenty plus years, where people say, well, is Microsoft just going to do what you’re doing Or why don’t they acquire you? Or, you know, so we’ve been answering that question for twenty plus years. And the short answer is, you know, we don’t compete against Microsoft, we compete in the ecosystem that is Microsoft.

And I think Microsoft has demonstrated over the past thirty years that they’re a great partner in terms of to participate with. And we are fortunate that we’ve been a partner for a long period of time and we are at a level that we participate in their development cycles. We get access to their products way early in terms of the roadmap. So if and when they were to actually introduce a product that might be competing with our product, we are part of their launch partners. We’re part of the dev process.

So we are intimately familiar with where they are headed. And then we are tweaking constantly over the past twenty years, how we are adjusting and ensuring that we can be coexisting and not only coexisting, but supporting them and their customer to get full value out of the Microsoft product and ensure the customer is getting full value of our products as well, but also making the best use and they’re achieving their objectives. And so for us, that is a common misconception that somehow we’re either competing with them, which is no, we don’t resell their products. We are kind of the last mile. Somebody used a good analogy of like the city planner where Microsoft has built the city.

But so all the utilities are in place, everything’s in place, but the last connection to your house and the fixtures in the house for the plumbing and everything else, it’s like that’s where their ecosystem comes into play and that’s where we play. So we’re not building the infrastructure over here, but we are completing the last mile.

Brett, Analyst: Awesome. All right. We’ll leave it there. Thank you. Really appreciate it.

Great. Thank

Jim, AvPoint: you. Thank you very much.

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