Cytokinetics at Needham Conference: Strategic Moves in Cardiovascular Health

On Monday, April 7, 2025, Cytokinetics Inc (NASDAQ: CYTK) presented at the 24th Annual Needham Virtual Healthcare Conference, discussing its strategic advancements in cardiovascular treatments. The company highlighted progress in its lead drug candidate, aficamtan, while also addressing its financial robustness and market expansion plans.

Key Takeaways

• Cytokinetics is confident in the FDA review of aficamtan, with no advisory committee meeting expected.
• The MAPLE trial results, comparing aficamtan to metoprolol, are anticipated in the second quarter.
• Financially, Cytokinetics started the year with $1.2 billion in cash and investments, expecting to utilize $500 million in 2025.
• The company is preparing for a potential aficamtan launch in the fourth quarter, pending FDA approval.
• Cytokinetics plans to leverage BMS's market awareness efforts to expand aficamtan's use.

Financial Results

• Cytokinetics reported a strong financial position with $1.2 billion in cash and investments at the start of the year.
• The company expects to utilize approximately $500 million in cash throughout the year.
• It has secured access to up to $350 million in term loans from Royalty Pharma, ensuring funding for aficamtan's launch and pipeline development.

Operational Updates

• Aficamtan's NDA is under FDA review, with a mid-cycle review completed, and manufacturing site inspections are on track.
• The MAPLE trial, a head-to-head comparison with metoprolol, is expected to provide results in the second quarter.
• The Acacia trial for non-obstructive HCM is progressing, with an enrollment update anticipated in May.
• Beyond aficamtan, Cytokinetics is advancing its heart failure programs, including omecamtiv and an HFpEF program.

Future Outlook

• Cytokinetics anticipates potential FDA approval of aficamtan in late September, with a U.S. launch in the fourth quarter.
• EMA approval is expected in the first half of 2026.
• The company aims to expand the HCM market, building on BMS's efforts and targeting broader utilization of aficamtan.
• Omecamtiv could be the next major readout and product approval, following aficamtan.

Q&A Highlights

• Cytokinetics expects a differentiated label for aficamtan, focusing on risk mitigation strategies.
• The MAPLE trial aims to demonstrate aficamtan's superior efficacy over metoprolol in improving exercise capacity.
• The company acknowledges a new competitor in phase 2 trials but emphasizes aficamtan's extensive clinical data and safety profile.

For more detailed insights, readers are encouraged to refer to the full conference call transcript.

Full transcript - 24th Annual Needham Virtual Healthcare Conference:

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Hi. Good afternoon. I'm Serge Belanger, one of the health care analysts at Neumann Company. Wanna welcome everybody to our twenty fourth annual health care conference. And for our next, fire chat session, we have the the Cytokinetics team with us.

So from the company, we have, the EVP of r and d, Fadi Malik, company CFO, Sung Lee, and chief commercial officer, Andrew Kalos. So before I hand it over to them to give us an overview of of Cytokinetics, just wanna highlight that we can take our q and a via the portal that you're watching the presentation on. So just submit them through through there, and we'll take them as they come. So I'll hand it over to the Sido team here and give us a quick overview of the company for those who aren't familiar with the company or recent developments.

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Sure. I can take that. Well, thanks for having us, Serge. I'm Fadi Malikvay, head of r and d. I'm joined by Sung Lee and Andrew Callis, our CFO and and chief commercial officer, respectively.

Cytokinetics is a muscle biology company that, you know, has pioneered ways of modulating muscle contractility, over the past twenty five years, and in contractility of the heart by focusing on the sarcomere, which is the fundamental structural unit of contractility in the heart. We have developed a number of molecules through the clinic. The one that is most advanced now is aficamtin, which is a cardiac myosin inhibitor that was developed to treat hypertrophic cardiomyopathy as a next in class molecule. That has completed a fairly extensive Phase I, II, and III program, with other trials ongoing in order to find its place in the context of other therapies, as well as to examine it in an adjacent population to the obstructive HCM population. The NDA has been at the FDA for a while.

We've recently put out an eight ks saying we've had our mid cycle review with FDA and believe that we still have a differentiated approach to labeling and risk mitigation as we've thought all along, really, with no, anticipated advisory committee, expected. Otherwise, we're looking at now MAPLE, a second trial, looking at a monotherapy trial of aficamtan versus beta blocker reading out in the second quarter and continuing to progress Acacia HCM, which is non obstructive trial patient of patients and, moving that forward. So maybe with that backdrop, I'll, I'll turn it back over to you, Serge, and we'll take any questions.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Perfect. Great overview. So I guess regarding the the ongoing review with FDA, like you said, you you did, put out an eight k recently. Just curious if the recent FDA changes, if you're aware of it's if they've impacted the, division that is reviewing the, aficamtan NDA?

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Well, we've, you know, we interacted with, folks before NDA and and during this review and as recently as the mid cycle. So far, you know, everybody is still the same. No change in the players there, including up to the division reviewers that are charge of our review. You never know what could change, but so far, we've been pleased to have the same group working with us.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Okay. But otherwise, it sounds like it's it's gone smoothly. No AdCom, manufacturing side inspections are are on schedule, or nothing's changed on that front?

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Nothing has changed, you know, beyond the course of the normal NDA review. I think at this point, we're fielding questions. We we answer questions. Inspections are scheduled and have been ongoing in some cases. And so far, you know, I think we will continue to progress our interactions with them, but we'll probably, you know, stay relatively silent on the details just given it's a Yep.

Always changing field.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: I'm sure you field a lot of questions about Aficamtan's potential product label and its REMS. So I'll ask the same thing. What are your current expectations for for both at this point?

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Well, I think, you know, I think I I guess maybe I'll answer and just say that, again, we we expect a differentiated label on risk mitigation. We know, obviously, BMS has a submitted for a modification to their REMS, which likely would include moving monitoring echos from every three months to every six months. That was, something that that they were able to achieve in Europe. But that's not the only, I think, point of differentiation between aficamtan and mavacamten. I think there are, many other features, that are intrinsic to aficamten specifically and are important, I think, to physicians.

Maybe I'll ask Andrew to comment on how he thinks the REMS, of mavacamten impacts its use and and and how aficamten may be, different.

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Yeah. So today, you know, based on the the syndicated data that we have available, it it would indicate that about 80% of, Mava's prescribing is with around 600, physicians, mainly cardiologists, and, centers of excellence. There's about a thousand active prescribers. There have been more prescribers over time, but that, again, what we see in our syndicated data. From our our market research, those physicians who weren't prescribing and are aware of the the category are referencing two centers of excellence as compared to treating treating themself treating patients themselves with a CMI, mainly because of the, administrative activities associated with a Itasu, REMS.

From when you look at the the areas of the Itasu REMS, again, we hear feedback on it's the echo monitoring, the window of when an echo is complete to, the timing of when a patient can fill a prescription and the drug to drug interaction monitoring, so those three elements. Based on SEQUOIA and the clinical data of SEQUOIA, obviously, we're still in negotiation and finalization of label with REMS as Fady alluded to. But our expectation in base case would be there will be areas of difference around, echo window, the ability to increase dose after the first echo and get the patients to, max dose. And and, you know, based on the number of echoes they they need in an echo at a time, you can increase dose provided that, your EF continues to stay above, fifty five or stabilized dose without the drug to drug interaction monitoring and with a broader window. So, you know, the expectation, would be that there is less administrative burden associated with the risk management program as well as areas of difference that we feel will be from a safety and from an efficacy point of view.

But ultimately, the label, will dictate that in terms of what we can describe prescribe or, I'm sorry, describe to our prescribers, around, the label and the differentiation.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: So the lessening of the echo requirement that BMS is seeking for Kamsios. Sounds like it could remove a potential point of differentiation, but still be a positive to increase the overall usage of CMIs. Is that how do you think about that?

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Yeah. We don't know what BMS submitted. But we have to the analog of Europe would indicate that maybe for most patients monitoring in the maintenance phase every six months. I believe BMS said that the prior approval supplement PDUFA date is April, so we should be finding out, soon on, what exactly was submitted and if they were successful in getting, approved, whatever it is they submitted. But when we when when the Cytokinetics submitted the eight k and we talked about differentiated labeling and differentiated REMS, that's with or without that change, if that's what the change is, that six month monitoring in the maintenance phase.

Because, again, we feel like aficamtan should have the ability in our base case to increase dose after each echo if if needed or maintain dose. It's not like you have to have multiple echos before you increase dose. Aficamtan's not we're not expecting to have drug to drug interaction monitoring, and we're not expecting to have such a narrow window of when an echo is done to when a patient can get a prescription filled. So those areas are, differentiating. Obviously, we won't make any comparisons in the marketplace, and I'm not making any now.

I mean, we have to understand what that label and risk management program, but we'll basically communicate and educate the cardiology community on our data and our areas of difference and whatever is needed, to ensure safe use.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: And in your market research, how much of a burden was the the original REMS that that was approved for for Kamsios, and was that a burden that was shared by both physicians and and patients?

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Yeah. So, I mean, we didn't use the word burden. I mean, one, mavacamten works from an efficacy point of view. I think, generally, we we see in our research that physicians and patients are, for the most part, satisfied with the efficacy. There are those physicians, especially in the community setting, that don't want to learn the REMS, get certified on the REMS.

They'd rather refer, to those that are more familiar with it and comfortable with it. Those that are comfortable with it, we hear they know how to manage it. They know how to get patients on, therapy, and, you know, they're growing their their prescriber base, although albeit a very concentrated market. But the overall REMS program, and the administrative resources required to, assure safe use is what keeps some cardiologists away from prescribing CMIs, at least based on our research.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Okay. And I think you've since you're coming second to market, you've had the the luxury or or benefit from learning from the first launch. So just curious what you think you can improve upon or, how your approach could be different.

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Sure. So, I mean, one, BMS has done a very nice job of building awareness. I think the DTC TV campaigns, the the unbranded work, working with with Viz dot ai to get a, you know, diagnosis rates increasing over time. So these kinds of things are generating more awareness for the market. When we do our studies, we were pleasantly surprised of how well the market has been seeded.

So, you know, over time, when you have a second entrant, when you have more, publications, education, in the community, perhaps even stronger guidelines with additional datasets, with Sequoia, hopefully, with Maple, these things should help grow categories. So I think what what happens is that the category hopefully will grow. Prescribing will expand beyond these, 600 or thousand of cardiologists. There's about 10,000 cardiologists who are eighty percent of cardiology prescribing or diagnosing of HCM. We're seeing an increase in diagnosis of NHCM.

We're gonna see a couple datasets readout in NHCM, both for BMS as well as for cytokines. So I think all these kinds of activities, should fuel market growth and opportunity, as there are, you know, hundreds of thousands of patients between obstructive and nonobstructive, many that are in the obstructive side that are treated with generics. So that's the expectation is that the the categories gets expanded, and, aficamtin gets pretty broad utilization because of the clinical profile.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Did we look at, the Camsios launch as a potential proxy for what Effie could could do upon becoming available?

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Yeah. I mean, it's it's hard to say until we get our our label on our risk program. I think there's about from what we can tell, there's about six thousand new patients per year added to a CMI. Maybe about fifteen or so percent of the overall, eligible obstructive HCM population currently being treated today. So that penetration, there's to be, you know, more than 80% of the market available, assuming we get approved at our PDUFA from that timing point of view.

So the ability for us to continue to, increase penetration in that market as well as, growing the market from an NHCM point of view, I think will be the critical drivers.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Okay. And and then in terms of timeline, so PDUFA is in late September. So a four q launch is is possible. And then in Europe, like, you have filed, but is it a second half twenty twenty five potential approval?

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Probably first half twenty six. Okay. Some of the clock stops are a little longer. It's a little bit different of a a regulatory approval process. There's two clock stops.

There's, member states. There's two, experts, if you will, that, give regulatory questions. And so we started the EMA process a little later than The US process, only by a few months. But our expectation is that we would get approved in, first half twenty six.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Okay. Going back to the the MAPLE trial, I think that's the next major catalyst you're expecting to read out in the second quarter. Have you given more granularity than second quarter at this point? Or

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: No. Not yet.

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Not yet. Alright.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: I had to try. I guess if you can just give us a kind of a well, you've given us an overview. It's a comparison of, AFI versus metropolol, but, you know, the purpose of the trial and what you would view, success or a positive outcome from Maple.

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Sure. Well, for the group, listening, the trial was designed to be a head to head trial of aficamtan as a monotherapy versus a beta blocker as a monotherapy. So beta blocker metoprolol is the most commonly used sort of first line treatment in hypertrophic cardiomyopathy. It's not been very rigorously studied. So I think our understanding of what actually it does for patients is not established.

And so while in SEQUOIA, our completed phase three trial, we enrolled patients who were on beta blockers as well as those that were not. We showed that aficamtin had similar efficacy in both groups, whether or not they're on beta blockers. Here, we wanted to look at patients who were being treated only with beta blockers and then compare that to aficamtan. They're randomized, they're treated with double blind, double dummy drug, so meaning everybody gets either an aficamtan or placebo metoprolol, or they get metoprolol and placebo aficamtan. So they truly can't tell really what they're getting.

And the other is the treatment duration is similar to Sequoia's, twenty four weeks. The endpoints are not that different either. It's a peak VO two at twenty four weeks, NYHA class, KCCQ, biomarkers, echo, and so forth. And what we hope to see from Maple is that aficamtan, proves to be superior in terms of efficacy, that it improves symptoms, gradient reductions, peak VO two to a greater extent than, beta blockers do and and and in a statistically significant fashion as well, that the safety of aficamtan, is is preserved, that we understand what maybe some of the challenges with dosing beta blockers are in these patients, as it will be more of a qualitative analysis of safety when all is said and done. But the long term goal is if the trial is positive, it's to support, elevate, if you will, aficamtin in the guidelines so that it's considered as an option for first line therapy as opposed to being, you know, the therapy of last resort when all other medical therapies have been exhausted.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Okay. And the the primary endpoint here is exercise capacity based on p v o two?

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Correct.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: So we've seen what afficampton can deliver in the SEQUOIA trial. Mhmm. What are the expectations for metroprolol? And, I guess, what are you powered for to to what difference are you powered for to demonstrate?

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Yeah. So metoprolol tends to have a slight negative impact on exercise performance. There was, you know, one crossover trial that was done a couple years ago that showed about a point five mil per kilo per minute reduction in peak VO two. So, you know, essentially no change or or slightly worse exercise performance. In that context, you know, we hope to see aficamtan replicates what we saw in SEQUOIA.

The patient population's a little different. It's not quite as severe as the SEQUOIA population was. The baseline data are published. And that was a little bit intentional because in SEQUOIA we enrolled essentially treatment failures, people that had very severe disease. Here we wanted to enroll the rest of the patient population with obstructive HCM you know, that were ineligible for SEQUOIA and as as well as patients that were eligible would would be would have been eligible for SEQUOIA, but, you know, to generate evidence across the whole spectrum of obstructive HCM.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Okay. Do you expect I know you plan this is part of the, regulatory strategy to, I guess, improve the label, once aficamtin is is approved. But do you also expect the the maple trough could support a a change in treatment guidelines and move efecamtin more upfront to a more upfront role than it could have with the the original approval?

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Well, I mean, I think if the trial is positive and and it, you know, wins on comparative efficacy and there are no new safety issues, and I would think that in an evidence based approach that it should be at least elevated to the same level as metoprolol that it had shown to be as effective or more effective than metoprolol. Guidelines tend to be very data driven as opposed to economics and things like that. Although I'm sure those will play a part, But the class, you know, the indication, if you will, the class of evidence and the level of recommendation is usually based on some fairly strict criteria, including know, quality of clinical data, number of trials, and things like that.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Yeah. And then the Acacia trial in nonobstructive HCM, we're still enrolling here to complete. Have we have you given timelines on when you expect enrollment completion and when we could see a readout?

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Yeah. We'll give a a more thorough update on our May earnings call, in terms of Acacia. You know, I think right now we will maintain our guidance of of finishing enrollment in the second half, although I will say enrollment has been very strong. And, I will sort of narrow that, in the coming earnings call.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Okay. And then, I guess, to complete our AFE Camden discussion, just talk about potential competitors. Obviously, there was news last week on a new competitor with their phase two trial. I don't know if you you wanna comment on on the data, but maybe if if there's anything we should be paying attention to as we try to compare phase two results from a a small patient number trial versus what you have for aficamtan?

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Yeah. I don't think I'll comment on it too extensively. I mean, I think there are well, you said it right there with aficamtan. We, now have hundreds of patients of being treated with aficamtan, hundreds of patient years of experience with aficamptan. And so I think we have a pretty good picture of what aficamptan looks like.

I think the EDGEWISE data are just still premature early. Obviously, there are some headwinds from their last data presentation. Time will tell. But, you know, I think there's a high bar set by aficamtan that, its safety profile, both in terms of efficacy, safety, and and, you know, occurrence of atrial fibrillation

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Yep.

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: That have to be met.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Alright. Well but it was they had a nice slide highlighting that, aficamtan was not impacted by atrial fibrillation. So

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Well, the difference actually an error, actually. I quoted the wrong numbers. I quoted numbers from an open label extension.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Which were actually lower.

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Which is, our phase two experience. If you restrict yourself to the clinical trial period, as has been published, that we had zero cases of atrial fibrillation during REDWOOD. They cited their open label experience, which is after patients had transitioned into the open label extension. So you have to somehow adjust for risk, a period of risk. At four weeks of data, they're now quoting months and months, if not years' worth of exposure.

I think, anyway, I'll just leave it at that.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Alright. I guess let's talk about omecamtiv. I think it was a subject that was a little controversial about a year ago when you announced your your plans for it. Just curious if the outlook for for that program has changed as people have done more work around it, and I guess where you are with the phase three trial.

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Well, think, you know, first of I'll comment on on the heart failure community. You know, they're tremendously supportive of us conducting this trial because they see strong clinical need in their patients that they treat that ultimately run out of their current treatment options, whose blood pressure becomes too low, who are failing despite being on best medical therapy. And and, you know, this is not a rare population. These are hundreds of thousands of people that end up in this bucket. So very strong support from the heart failure community as well as, you know, many of the leaders in heart failure clinical research in around the world.

The investor community, I think, is starting to understand the potential value of this. I mean, it's still quite a ways off in the future and not something that they've really done a lot of homework around. But, you know, as aficamtan gets into its third, fourth year of launch, I'm pretty sure people will be asking us, well, what's next? And, omecamtiv will be or what's next. You know?

It'll it'll be the next major readout, potentially the next product approval. And, I think, you know, we're well positioned with a the data from an 8,000 patient trial to have designed a confirmatory trial that we're conducting now.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: And what would be the the market opportunity for the the target population that you're you're addressing here?

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Yeah. So the market opportunity, I mean, if you look at the those with heart failure with an EF less than thirty that are, more severe, that's probably around eight hundred thousand, maybe up to a million patients in that range. They're the ones that are also the highest cost to the Medicare, system, highest rates of hospitalization. So that's a population we'll be serving as an add on to guideline directed medical therapy. Okay.

It's gonna be entering a market that'll be our expectation generic by then, SGLT twos, Entresto, as well as the other, pillars of guideline directed therapy at that point in time as well. So, you know, given the high unmet need, given the high cost, if you if, we can certainly show reduction of hospitalization and utilization of overall health care, I think there's also a good economic argument beyond the clinical argument.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Got it. And then, your HFpEF program kinda just getting, underway with the the AMBER trial. Maybe, Andrew, if you could highlight that market opportunity and how it differs from you know, within HF, what does, HFpEF look like?

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: It really depends on where we land, in terms of our clinical profile. And, you know, Fadi can certainly talk about that as the EF cutoff is 60 or higher, 65 or higher. How big is that number as well? It's kind of the other end of the spectrum relative to omecamtiv on heart failure. You know, that could be around a million patients as well.

You you we do see SGLT2s, utilized in HFpEF, Entresto up to a certain level of EF. I think it's around 57 where the clinical data shows benefit. So there's certainly a lot of high unmet need, especially in this, much higher relative rate of HFpEF, from an EF point of view. So I think we need to do a little bit more work clinically to determine where we think we're gonna land in that profile.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Then, Sung, I haven't forgotten about you. If you can just give us an overview of the financials and give us an idea of where the cash balance is, especially in this kind of market we're currently are? Like, a lot of

Sung Lee, CFO, Cytokinetics: it Yeah. Sure. And that's really a strength of the company right now. We started the year with 1,200,000,000.0 in cash and investments. And of course, we arrived at that point because of the financing we did last May.

The timing is fortuitous given the, climate we're in today. In terms of guidance for this year, we've also guided that, you can expect about the low $500,000,000 in terms of cash utilization. So you can see by the time we get to the end of this year, we would still have a strong balance sheet and the PDUFA date presumably behind us. In addition to the cash and investments, we have access to further capital and this is by way of royalty pharma term loans up to $350,000,000 we've already qualified for half of that. The other half is tied to, the approval of aficamtan in The US.

So all in all, we're we're in a position of strength here in terms of the balance sheet, and, we're able to, fund the launch of aficamtan and and beyond.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Okay. Maybe just to wrap up, I'll leave it open to all three of you, but anything you feel is misunderstood or underappreciated currently in in the story?

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Well, I think, you know, the catalyst that we have coming, up in the future as we kind of covered them, I mean, when you put the whole picture together, I think we're uncommon company in these turbulent times. We've well capitalized, as Sung just reviewed. We have several important catalysts coming up, near term product revenues, and, and a pipeline that we have established and and are committed to expanding over time. So, it's a you know, it's an exciting time for Cytokinetics, and and with several near term value drivers, that that will hopefully avoid provide some buoyancy to the stock, but you know, as well as enable us to deliver on our commitment to patients.

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: Yeah. I mean, the only thing I'd just add to that is if you look over the next four to five years, leading with, hopefully approval at the in September based on Sequoia, a supplemental NDA with Maple, probably a year after that, Acacia for nonobstructive, which likely is gonna be a larger population than the obstructive population. Not long after that, omecamtiv for heart failure. All of this done on the same infrastructure and, fuel force as well as, commercial kinda engine, if you will, around the same prescriber base, but there may be some some addition of fuel force, but not meaningful. So you're really talking about a tremendous amount of synergy as well as, added value to a patient and prescriber point of view when you think about three different patient populations across two different molecules in such a short time frame.

Serge Belanger, Health Care Analyst, Neumann Company: Alright. I think we'll wrap it up here. We're up on time. So I wanted to thank all three of you for spending time with us this afternoon and telling more about Cytokinetics and some of the exciting catalysts that are upcoming here.

Andrew Kalos, Chief Commercial Officer, Cytokinetics: So Thanks, George. Appreciate it.

Fadi Malikvay, EVP of R&D, Cytokinetics: Thank you. Thank for listening.

This article was generated with the support of AI and reviewed by an editor. For more information see our T&C.