Earnings call transcript: CLIQ Digital Q2 2025 sees sales dip, EBITDA rise

CLIQ Digital AG’s second-quarter 2025 earnings call revealed a mixed performance, with a notable decline in sales but a significant increase in EBITDA. The stock, currently trading at $3.63, has declined 30.84% year-to-date, though InvestingPro analysis suggests the shares are currently undervalued. CLIQ Digital’s future guidance remains uncertain as the company navigates challenges in payment processing and market conditions.

Key Takeaways

• Group sales declined to €98 million from €141 million in 2024.
• EBITDA increased by over 30% to €6.5 million, improving the EBITDA margin to 7%.
• The company withdrew its previous 2025 financial outlook due to uncertainties.
• CLIQ Digital is exploring alternative payment options amidst payment processing challenges.

Company Performance

CLIQ Digital experienced a decline in group sales, falling to €98 million from €141 million in the same period last year. Despite this, the company managed to boost its EBITDA by over 30%, reaching €6.5 million, with an improved EBITDA margin of 7%. The company maintains a strong financial position with a healthy current ratio of 4.9 and low debt-to-equity of 0.05. This performance reflects the company’s focus on cost efficiency and operational improvements, even as it faces challenging market conditions. For detailed financial health metrics and additional insights, check out the comprehensive analysis available on InvestingPro.

Financial Highlights

• Revenue: €98 million, down from €141 million in 2024.
• EBITDA: €6.5 million, up over 30% year-over-year.
• Net profit: €500,000, down from €900,000 in Q1.
• Operating free cash flow: €20 million, showing significant growth.

Outlook & Guidance

The company has withdrawn its previous financial outlook for 2025, citing uncertainties related to payment processing challenges and market conditions. Despite these challenges, CLIQ Digital maintains a strong free cash flow yield of 65% and continues focusing on adapting to changes in the payment ecosystem while maintaining strict cost discipline. InvestingPro subscribers can access exclusive ProTips and detailed financial health scores to better understand the company’s position in this challenging environment.

Executive Commentary

CEO Luke Vonken stated, "We are actively engaging with our payment service partners to gather further information." This highlights the company’s proactive approach to addressing payment processing issues. Management Board Member Ben Boss added, "While our top line remains under pressure, the underlying cost structures have improved," emphasizing the company’s focus on cost efficiency.

Risks and Challenges

• Payment Processing: New Visa acquiring monitoring program restrictions could impact sales.
• Market Conditions: Sales declined in North America due to currency effects, though European and Latin American markets showed growth.
• Customer Base: A reduction in the customer base to 600,000 may affect future revenue.
• Regulatory Changes: The FTC "Click to Cancel" rule poses minimal impact but remains a consideration.

Q&A

During the earnings call, analysts focused on the impact of payment processing issues, particularly in Europe, and the company’s strategies to mitigate these challenges. CLIQ Digital’s exploration of alternative payment methods and its minimal impact from the FTC rule were also discussed.

Full transcript - CLIQ Digital AG (CLIQ) Q2 2025:

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for joining Group’s earnings call for the second quarter twenty twenty five, and we appreciate your continued interest in our company. My name is Sebastian McCoskry, and I head CLIC’s Investor Relations. I will be your host for today’s results presentation and q and a. As usual, Luke Vonken, our CEO, will kick off with CLIC’s current state of affairs and an operational overview of the first half year and q two.

Then Ben Boss, our other management board member, will walk you through the group’s financials. After that, both gentlemen will answer the questions you kindly sent in via email this morning. Ladies and gentlemen, please take note of the disclaimer shown here and that this call is being recorded. The visual audio and or transcription of this call may be published, including any of the data arising therefrom. If you have any objection, please disconnect at this time.

So without further ado, over to you, Luc.

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Thank you, Sebastian, and a warm welcome, everybody, from my side. Let’s begin with a brief update on the important strategic developments and Click’s current ownership structure. Ladies and gentlemen, we were informed by our payment service providers of significant developments taking place across the global digital payments ecosystem. These changes, driven by new policies introduced by card schemes and acquirer banks, are currently seriously impacting our business operations. So much so that our ability to acquire new customers is materially restricted.

Also, our ability to process payments for our existing customers is limited. These disruptions represent a major operational constraint for us. Consequently, we are at present unable to reliably quantify the full financial impact. The newly announced regulatory standards introduced by card schemes and acquiring banks have reshaped how services must be launched, reviewed and monitored. We are actively engaging with our payment service partners to gather further information that will allow us to assess the overall extent of our exposure and find viable solutions.

However, based on what we know now, we expect these changes to have a material adverse effect on our sales over the remainder of the financial year 2025. As a result, we also anticipate a negative impact on EBITDA and on certain items in the balance sheet, particularly capitalized contract costs as well as on our off balance sheet operational indicator, the lifetime value of the customer base. Given this increased uncertainty and our current inability to assess the full financial implications, we have taken the decision to withdraw our previously communicated outlook for 2025. We will provide an update as soon as we have more visibility. We are working very hard to mitigate the impact and adapt swiftly to the evolving regulatory and payment landscape.

While these developments are unexpected and challenging, we remain committed to safeguarding the company’s operations and improving, tweaking our business model accordingly. The latest news yesterday was of Dylan’s decision to vote against their original proposal to our AGM in two weeks’ time for a public partial share repurchase offer. Dillions Media’s decision follows our guidance withdrawal that I just explained and is and is based on the precautionary principle that the preservation of liquidity is the most responsible short term course of action for Click. Dylan no longer supports the use of company funds for an off market share buyback under the current circumstances. Taking into account Dylan’s Media’s updated position and the challenging business environment, Ben and I have decided that we will no longer consider a delisting of the company’s shares in the foreseeable future.

We shall continue to meet all relevant open market reporting obligations, and thereby, we are currently reviewing the scope and frequency we are proceeding with plans to report our third quarter results in November, albeit in a more streamlined and efficient format. Ladies and gentlemen, I believe it’s pretty meaningful to the overall context to show you clearly our current ownership structure. As of today, Click has approximately 6,500,000.0 issued shares. The ownership is split roughly three ways. Dyln Media BV and members of the management and supervisory boards jointly hold around 41% of the company’s share capital.

The remaining 49% is in free float. And last but not least, roughly 10% are held as treasury shares, which are non voting and non dividend bearing. We are in the technical process to redeem these treasury shares. Such a redemption would result in a corresponding reduction in the company’s share capital. And after this reduction, Dillon would then hold around 46% of the outstanding share capital.

Let’s now move to the operational aspects of the quarter and half year. Over the first six months of twenty twenty five, market conditions remained tough. Above all, we maintained our profitability first discipline at halved the customer acquisition costs from €54,000,000 to €27,000,000 Consequently, the customer base dropped to 600,000 as of the June. And group sales declined to EUR98 million, down from EUR141 million in the 2024. Our lifetime value softened to €72 down from €80 in the first six months of twenty twenty four.

Nonetheless, EBITDA increased by over 30% to €6,500,000 with the EBITDA margin reaching 7%, up from 3% in the prior year first half. Our headcount further reduced from 132 to 109, also as part of our continued strategic cost streamline. Quarter on quarter, our customer acquisition costs were reduced from EUR 15,000,000 to EUR 12,000,000. Sales dropped marginally from €50,000,000 to €48,000,000 despite falling customer numbers. But EBITDA edged up from €3,200,000 to €3,300,000 with the margin improving to 7%.

Overall, the second quarter was marked by further cost control and modest productivity gains, but also by difficult market conditions with significant churn as well as currency pressure from the weaker U. S. Dollar. Allow me now to hand over to Ben, who will dive deeper into our financials.

Ben Boss, Management Board Member, CLIC: Thanks, Luke, and good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. In the 2025, we saw a modest yet meaningful stabilization in our strategic key performance indicators. For us, the highlights here in the EBITDA margin development improving from 4% to 7% over the last five quarters. This clearly reflects our steadfast discipline on spending and indicates that our profitability first strategy is continuing to take effect despite the macro headwinds. Absolute sales level declined only slightly by 4% quarter on quarter, And thus the business continued to stabilize sales notably and operate with leaner cost structures on the back of significantly lower customer acquisition cost.

Importantly, the efficiency of our marketing, our new customer acquisitions improved as our marketing cost ratio marked better quarter on quarter. These improvements helped to offset revenue pressures from a challenging market environment. Regionally, the sales contribution remained largely consistent with prior periods. Quarter on quarter sales in North America in the second quarter declined by 7%, solely due to the foreign currency exchange effect resulting from a weaker US dollar. To give you the full picture, group sales in the second quarter dropped quarter on quarter by 4%.

However, adjusted for the FX impact, sales grew by 3%. In Europe, sales grew sequentially for the first time again since q four twenty twenty three, namely by 5%, thanks to a higher LTV in that region. But it’s still tough in Europe, and we need to see conclusive proof before we can talk about the turnaround. In Latin America, our quarter on quarter sales growth accelerate again to 11%. As an aside, the sales composition by service remained focused with approximately 98% generated through bundled content services, our core product category.

By the June 2025, our customer base stood at 600,000 compared to the 800,000 at the end of the first quarter. This reduction was driven primarily by the group’s stronger focus on profitability than on sales growth, whereby the target CPA, the cost per acquisition was reduced, which led to less new customer acquisition. But not so we’re standing this, the average lifetime value of a customer increased slightly to €75 against the prior quarter, reflecting the successful acquisition of a higher value and just more profitable new customers in Europe. The income statement for the second quarter reflected a continuation of trends seen in q one with a slightly weaker top line but improved earnings quality. As just mentioned, sales declined quarter on quarter modestly by 4% to €48,000,000, a drop caused by the effects, the weakening of the US dollar in particular.

But adjusted for those FX effects, our sales were up 3%. Our cost of sales excluding the customer acquisition cost for a period also declined sequentially by over 7%. That’s more than the corresponding sales decline, which further underscores our cost discipline and overcompensated the higher operating expense of €1,300,000 resulting mostly from strategic personal cost cuts. Group EBITDA improved quarter on quarter by 5% to €3,300,000 which translated to a stronger margin of 6.9%. Depreciation and amortization expenses increased moderately, which led to a decline in EBIT from 1,600,000 to €1,400,000.

Whilst the financial results and tax expenses remained broadly stable, net profit came in at €500,000 compared to the €900,000 in the first quarter. Consequently, base earnings per share decreased from $0.16 to $09 Our income statement shows that while pressured at the bottom line, we continued our tight cost control and incremental margin expansion. Let’s go to the customer acquisition cost. Our strong focus on profitability drove a further tightening of customer acquisition spent during the quarter. This reduction while impacting year on year top line growth was a necessary step in maintaining financial discipline during difficult times.

Total customer acquisition costs were reduced by 20% quarter on quarter from 50,000,000 in q one to €12,000,000 in q two. This reflects management’s decision to lower the target CPA in adherence of to the group’s profitability first strategy and in light of market volatility. Customer acquisition cost for the period were down by 10% from 70,100,000.0 in q one to €15,400,000 in q two. And as you can see, the marketing cost ratio, the eight cap for the period, the customer acquisition cost for the period as a percentage of total sales further improved from 41% in q one to 32% in q two, confirming the improved marketing efficiency and more targeted approach to customer onboarding. Let’s go to a favorite topic, cash conversion and cash composition.

Ladies and gentlemen, one of the clear highlights of the second quarter was a strong cash generation. Operating free cash flow increased significantly from €2,100,000 in q one to June in Q2. This improvement was driven by a combination of a reduction in customer acquisition cost and a continued tight operational cost control as well as an incremental margin expansion and lesser corporate tax payments. Cash tax paid were €2,800,000, which was lower than the €4,800,000 recorded in the first quarter. Investing and finance activities remained modest with only around a half a million euros of cash outflow each during the quarter.

At the June, our net cash position reached €20,000,000, up from 30,600,000.0 at the March. This strong liquidity position provides a solid foundation for the second half of the year. The group’s balance sheet remains robust and well capitalized, but might be strongly affected by the current situation going forward. As of June 30, total assets amounted to €94,000,000 compared to 98 at the year end 2024. This slight reduction was mainly due to the continued decrease in contract cost, consistent with our shift towards lower marketing spend as well as a further amortization of our technical platform developments.

We expect that the recent developments regarding the payments ecosystem will likely have a significantly adverse effect on a contract cost in future periods. And as already mentioned, cash rose sharply to €20,000,000 plus trade and other receivables decreased further. On the liability side, we continue to operate with zero bank borrowings further underlying the strength and simplicity of our capital structure. Deferred tax liabilities reduced to €5,700,000 and income tax payables were cleared completely during the period. Our equity increased marginally to €73,300,000 resulting in an equity ratio of 78% compared to 72% at the 2024.

Our lifetime value of the customer base totaled €89,000,000 at the ’2, but as Luke mentioned earlier, the significant developments in the digital payment ecosystems will also negatively affect this off balance sheet operationally indicator going forward. Ladies and gentlemen, while our top line remains under pressure, the underlying cost structures have improved. We will continue to balance growth initiative with profitability discipline and will reassess our CAC invest CAC investments levels in the second half depending on market conditions, digital product developments, and customer response. The year 2025 has proven to be and will continue to be a demanding period for our business. To navigate these tough conditions successfully, we must focus on adapting to require changes in the digital payment ecosystem while maintaining strict cost discipline and cash flow management.

We remain confident that we are able to get back on track despite the recent developments in this global payment ecosystem. So let’s go to the q and a. So thank you for your attent attention, and that concludes our presentation today. We shall now commence our q and a session. So, Sebastian, our first question, please.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Our first questions today are from Robert Paulhausen at Astaris Capital Management and directed to Luke. Robert asks, I read the news about the payment issues, which is disappointing. Who is your payment provider, and what are these new standards?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, thank you, Robert, for your questions. Regarding the entity the identity of our payment service provider, we ask for your understanding that we cannot disclose the specific name publicly, of course. This is due to competition reasons and confidentiality obligations that we are bound by. Our focus remains on resolving these matters construct constructively and improving our payment infrastructure for the future. We are working hard to find a solution and are actively engaged with existing and alternative partners to secure continuity in our payment processing capabilities.

As for the new standards affecting our operations, they relate to the implementation of Visa’s acquiring monitoring program, named VAMP, which is scheduled to come into force on 10/01/2025. VAMP introduces stricter global requirements for acquirers and merchants with a focus on chargeback performance and fraud risk classification. In anticipation of these changes, some acquiring banks have reclassified certain merchant IDs, so called MIDS, as high risk and have stopped processing transactions for them. This has affected our ability to process payments from a portion of our customer base and to acquire new customers. We are doing everything we can do to mitigate the impact and adapt swiftly to the evolving regulatory and payment landscape.

While these developments are unexpected and challenging, we remain committed to safeguarding the company’s operations and improving, tweaking our business model.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Our next three questions are from Koen Binatz at Antia for Ben. Koen asks, could you elaborate on what the impact is of the current restrictions to process payments from part of

Ben Boss, Management Board Member, CLIC: the existing customer base and what you exactly mean with it. Thanks, Kun. When we refer to restrictions to process payments from part of their existing customer base, we mean that certain acquiring banks have, in response to evolving card scheme standards, altered the processing of transactions linked to specific merchant ID associated with click. So this has resulted in a a portion of existing customers being unable to complete recurring subscriptions payments. This impact is currently being evaluated in close cooperation with our payment service partners, and we are actively engaging with alternative acquiring banks to restore full processing capacity as soon as possible.

How does the announcement regarding the payment standards affect the revolving credit facility of €15,000,000 of HSBC? Are there any discussions with HSBC regarding the renewal of the credit line or breach of covenants? There has been no breach of governance, and we remain remain fully compliant with all terms. The current facility is structured with minimal covenant requirements, so there’s no immediate impact stemming from the developments in the payment ecosystem. We currently hold a strong net net cash position of over €20,000,000 and continue to manage our liquidity proactively.

That said, we remain in a regular and constructive dialogue with HSBC about our financing structure.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: And lastly, did Dylan Media, by your knowledge, sell any of its shares in the last month? This is for investors a relevant question as the owner of Dylan is also a member of the board of directors.

Ben Boss, Management Board Member, CLIC: Appreciate it, Kun. And to our knowledge, Telemedia has not sold any of its shares in Click in the past months. Delta Media remains a committed long term shareholder, and with a holding of around 46% of the outstanding share capital, our largest shareholder.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Next up, a question sent in by Uwe Siebatt. Ben, Uwe asks, regarding your statement with the payment service providers, I understand that it’s been early days to assess the financial impacts. Could you give at least a ballpark estimate on how huge the challenge is, not only financially, but also in terms of subscriptions and number of payments or a timeline when you will have further information and plan to resolve it? Will there also be an impact on future subscriptions since the last time when payment service providers changed the service scheme, our business was heavily disrupted? Do you see any further disruptions coming from the change this time, or do you have a timeline when you could assess the longer term impacts?

Thank you.

Ben Boss, Management Board Member, CLIC: Thank you, Oe. It’s indeed still early days for quantifying the full impact of the recent developments with our payment service infrastructure. At this stage, we are actively working with our payment service partners to fully assess the situation. We we are not yet in a position to provide reliable estimates, neither in financial terms nor in specific subscription numbers or transaction volumes. As mentioned, a portion of the recurring payments from the existing subscribers cannot currently be processed, and new customers acquisition is also temporarily constrained in affected markets.

However, this is not a full system disruption, and many parts of our business remain fully operational. The degree of disruption will ultimately depend on how quickly we can either resolve the issue with the affected acquiring banks or successfully onboard new partners. We understand the concern, your concern, the market concern regarding potential future subscriptions. While it is true that previous changes to customer care tools in place and the card scheme companies led to significantly higher churn rates, We are actively pursuing multiple risk mitigation strategies and corrective actions in parallel this time.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Oland Pecker wrote, as a shareholder, I’m especially interested in the statement in the today announced q two highlights. Certain card schemes and acquiring banks are no longer allowing the processing of payments authorized by existing Click Digital customers. These stat new standards currently limit the company’s ability to process payments from some of its existing customer base and to acquire new customers. What exactly does that mean, and why is that problem not solvable since other companies don’t seem to have the same problem? How can credit card institutes deny a by the customer authorized payment?

This is a problem for over a year, which wasn’t explained until now in detail by the management of Click Digital. Shareholders finally deserve an answer. Look. Luke, what do you answer, Roland?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, thank you, Roland. It’s important to note that this does not imply customer authorizations were invalid or that card networks are arbitrarily rejecting legitimate payments. Rather requiring banks have discretion on the card scheme rules to block transactions associated with merchant IDs, they deem noncompliant with updated program thresholds and even if the end user has authorized the transaction. While it may seem that other companies don’t have the same problem, this is not entirely accurate. Many subscription based digital service providers, especially those with multi merchant structures and international footprints, have faced similar challenges under the evolving Visa and Mastercard compliance regimes.

However, the visibility of those issues can vary as companies respond differently based on the structure of the acquiring relationships, dispute ratios, and operational complexity. As to why this issue has not been resolved yet, it’s not a purely internal click issue that can be fixed by a product or process tweak. It retry it requires coordinated action between our payment service provider, current and potential new acquiring banks, and the card schemes themselves.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Ralph Marinoni at Corinne has the following questions for Luke. You explained that certain card schemes and acquiring banks don’t allow processing payments authorized by existing customers of Click any longer. Is this the case for North America and Europe or North America only?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, thank you, Ralph. The current restrictions primarily affect Europe where certain acquiring banks have stopped processing transactions linked to specific merchant identifiers associated with CLIC. The restrictions will also affect The US just to a lesser extent.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: How important is credit card payment at present?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, credit card processing remains one of the most important payment channels for click digital subscription based services. It supports 98% of the group sales and is deeply embedded in our customer journey. Any disruption to credit card processing, therefore, has a meaningful impact.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: In this context, does it make sense to switch to alternative payment systems such as Apple Pay, Google Pay, or PayPal, or are there other alternatives?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, of course, we are actively evaluating additional payment options, including Apple Pay, Google Pay, and PayPal. These methods could play an important role in diversifying and strengthening our payments infrastructure, especially in markets where credit card coverage is less stable or where we face restrictions on the current merchant identifiers. However, integration timelines and regulatory compliance vary across partners, of course, and regions. So we are approaching this step in a parallel with restoring core credit card functionality. And our long term goal is to create a more resilient and diversified payment setup.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Dylan Media holds 25% of Click’s share capital. And together with members of Click’s management and supervisory boards, 41% of the company’s share capital are held. Do you do you know what Dylan Media plans with its share package?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, as of today, we have no indication that Dylan Media intends to change its shareholding in Click Digital. Together with the members of the management and supervisory boards, this group represents around 41% of our total share capital. And as always, any changes to major shareholdings would be subject to statutory disclosure requirements.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Our next questions are from Stein Elibault at Federale. He asks, Luke, could you give an update of the Fit for Future program?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Yes. Of course. I’m happy to provide an update. The Fit for the Future transformation program was concluded in the first quarter of this year and is now hardwired into how we operate. It enabled us to streamline our organizational structure, reduce personal cost, and shut down legacy systems.

And as a result, Click is leaner, more focused, and better aligned with our profitability first strategy. That said, while the foundations are in place, the productivity gains we are targeting have not yet fully materialized. And some early signals are encouraging, but they are not yet consistent or scalable. So while the formal program has ended, we do expect to continue fine tuning our organization as we push for greater efficiency and structural competitiveness.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: Could you give more color on this vague statement? The background of such rejections are significant developments in the digital payments ecosystem driven by newly announced worldwide regulatory standards introduced by card schemes and acquiring banks. Is this related to certain players in the industry like Worldline?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, as previously mentioned, this primary concerns the global tightening of fraud and dispute thresholds by card schemes, especially Visa, Mastercard, as part of structured programs which affect specific needs. These programs require acquiring banks to proactively screen and act on merchants that are trending toward or exceeding predefined risk thresholds. And even if transactions were previously authorized by the customer. So, really, this affects many players in the market.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: What is the recommendation of the members of Click’s management and supervisory boards in the function as a shareholder of Click concerning the proposed share buyback?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, the original proposal was made upon request of Dylan Media. And giving their percentage of shareholding Click, we presume that this resolution will not pass at the upcoming AGM as they will vote against a repurchase program. As members of the management board, we are currently primarily concerned with the developments announced on 08/05/2025 and their impact on our financial position. In light of those developments, we understand Delend Media’s move to no longer pursue to repurchase program. As announced yesterday, we currently no longer follow a strategy to delist the company.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: As members of Click’s management are also involved at Dylan Media, how are the potential conflicts of interest handled? With all the strange moves, first tender offer, then no tender offer, but share buyback, now no share buyback anymore, It feels that minority shareholders are missing some pieces of the puzzle.

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Well, Stein, the management board remains fully commitment committed to transparent communication. Rest assured that the management board and the supervisory board of Click Digital AG remained fully committed to the fiduciary duties to act in the best interest of the company and all its stakeholders. This responsibility guides every step we take, especially regarding decisions of strategic significance for the company. All potential conflicts of interest of a board member were disclosed to the other board members and adequate measures to deal with the conflict were discussed in each individual case. All relevant conflicts of interest were handled in accordance with the law.

Sebastian McCoskry, Investor Relations Head, CLIC: And our last question today came in from doctor Peter Bensky for Luke. On the July 14, the FTC’s click to cancel rule went into effect. Can you specify the impact on clicks business, please?

Luke Vonken, CEO, CLIC: Yes. Of course. Thank you, Peter, for that question. We were all aware of the Federal Trade Commission’s click to cancel rule. The regulation largely formalizes existing US requirements for clear and simple cancellation processes aiming to prevent unnecessary barriers for customers, which we have also in place already for several years.

As previously communicated at the beginning of last year, these standards had already begun to influence the market and thus. In 2024, we already observed elevated churn levels across all regions driven by tightened refund and cancellation practices in anticipation of regulatory changes.

Ben Boss, Management Board Member, CLIC: So ladies and gentlemen, this was our last question for this afternoon. Should you have any further questions, please reach out to Sebastian. Thank you for joining our second quarter twenty twenty five earning call today. Have a great day, and all the best.

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