TSX runs higher on rate cut expectations
Enity Holding AB reported a robust financial performance for the second quarter of 2025, with a significant increase in operating profit and a stable net interest margin. Following the earnings announcement, Enity’s stock rose by 6.78%, reflecting positive investor sentiment. With a market capitalization of $713 million and an impressive gross profit margin of nearly 100%, the company’s focus on digital transformation and strategic acquisitions has bolstered its position in the Nordic mortgage market. According to InvestingPro analysis, Enity appears to be slightly overvalued at current levels, though analysts maintain a strong buy recommendation.
Key Takeaways
- Enity’s total lending grew by 9.3% to SEK 29.6 billion.
- Adjusted operating profit increased by 38% year-over-year to SEK 177 million.
- The stock price surged by 6.78% following the earnings release.
- Enity completed the acquisition of E.J. Dansenans and issued an AT1 bond of SEK 250 million.
Company Performance
Enity Holding AB demonstrated strong performance in the second quarter, with notable growth in its lending portfolio and operating profit. The company’s strategic focus on digital transformation and automation has contributed to its competitive edge in the Nordic mortgage market, particularly in segments underserved by traditional banks. The successful completion of its IPO and strategic acquisition of E.J. Dansenans further strengthened its market position.
Financial Highlights
- Total lending: SEK 29.6 billion (+9.3% YoY)
- Adjusted operating profit: SEK 177 million (+38% YoY)
- Net interest margin: 4.2%
- Return on tangible equity: 23.9% in Q2
Outlook & Guidance
Enity aims to achieve loan book growth of 8-10% over the business cycle and maintain a return on tangible equity of around 20%. The company remains optimistic about potential regulatory changes that could benefit first-time buyers, further supporting its growth projections. Enity’s revenue forecasts for FY2025 and FY2026 stand at USD 126.59 million and USD 135.15 million, respectively.
Executive Commentary
CEO Bjorn Lander highlighted the resilience of Enity’s business model, stating, "We have proven that our model and business is resilient." He emphasized the company’s commitment to organic growth, noting, "We are keen to grow the company. So we will continue to focus on growing the loan book organically."
Risks and Challenges
- Market volatility: Fluctuations in the Nordic mortgage markets could impact Enity’s growth.
- Regulatory changes: Potential regulatory shifts might affect the company’s operations.
- Economic conditions: Economic downturns in key markets like Finland could pose challenges.
- Competition: Increasing competition in the mortgage sector could pressure margins.
Enity Holding AB’s strategic initiatives and strong financial performance in Q2 2025 position it well for future growth, despite potential market challenges.
Full transcript - Enity Holding AB (ENITY) Q2 2025:
Conference Moderator: Welcome to the NTT Q2 twenty twenty ’5 Report Presentation. Now I will hand the conference over to CEO, Bjorn Lander and CFO, Pontus Sardal. Please go ahead.
Bjorn Lander, CEO, Energy Holdings: Good morning, everyone, and welcome to Energy Holdings and this presentation of the second quarter twenty twenty five. My name is Bjorn Lander. I’m the CEO of Energy. I’m here today together with our CFO, Pontus Sardal. We’ll start with a with a short introduction to to Ennety.
We are the leading Nordic pure play specialist mortgage bank with operations across The Nordics. We launched in Sweden more than twenty years ago and took the the concept to to Norway in 2010. And then finally, we launched our Finnish operations almost five years ago. The purpose and the vision is to make the mortgage market accessible to more people. We typically help customers reacted by the traditional banks for various reasons.
It could be that they have a nontraditional type of employment or they are self employed or they have a short credit history or even retirees. Today, operate through three consumer brands, SXTE plus Bank in Sweden, Bluster Bank present in all three markets and Bank2, a company we acquired in October 2023. And Bank2 is now fully incorporated and integrated into Energy Bank, and we decided to keep the Consumer Brand Bank too. Then we also have investments into loan brokers in Norway called Enofs Finance and Unnof Finance. Key highlights for the second quarter, a very strong quarter.
I’m very pleased to see the development of the bank. We saw a loan book growth of 9.3% organically, if we adjust them for a week in Norwegian kroner. So that’s absolutely great to see. We have seen a very strong adjusted operating profit, up significantly from the same quarter last year. Very low and stable net credit losses.
We posted 24 basis points in terms of net credit losses for the last twelve months. We have improved the cost to income ratio also quite significantly Q2 twenty five compared to the same quarter last year, thanks to the transformation that has been ongoing for quite some time in the company, consolidating tech platforms, working with automation initiatives and so forth. Solid capitalization in place, CET1 ratio at 14.7% and an adjusted return on tangible equity in the quarter of twenty three point nine percent. A couple of other key highlights in the quarter, of course, I mean, we completed the IPO mid June, highlighting again, a very good step for the bank, taking the step now to becoming a public company, broadening the becoming shareholder base. We get access to the capital market and we also get the chance to continue to build the entity brand.
We also acquired the remaining shares in E. J. Dansenans, the Norwegian broker I mentioned. And the last thing to highlight here is that we have optimized the capital structure during the second quarter and ahead of the IPO, we issued an A2I bond of SEK $250,000,000, paid the same amount in dividend pre IPO. Entity have a very strong value proposition.
We are operating in an underpenetrated high growth segment driven by secular trends. We work for financial and social inclusion, which give us a strong kind of proposition out there. We generate high returns, which give us then firepower to both grow organically as well as pay dividend. And again, we offer mortgages only, 100% secured, which give us low and predictable credit losses. Then we have diversified and very flexible funding model in place, which we will get back to later on.
And also we have a very modern, scalable, and cloud based tech platform, which is also then a part of the the explanation to why we have seen such a good development in terms of cost to income ratio. And last but not least, a very, very strong management team and a very strong organization within the Energy Bank. And as you can see on the right hand side, clearly then again, strong organic growth, high returns in combination with very low cost of risk. That’s the key differentiator to most banks in this region. Short about the loan book development.
Again, high level at group level, we are growing more than 9% organically, which I think is great. It’s a very, very good sign given that we are still a bit still in the kind of the old macro with kind of weaker markets across. If you zoom in at the different markets, starting with Finland, we performed very well in the second quarter and grew strongly. If you look at the Finnish market, I would say, are still weak market. House prices has continued down during the 2025.
We can see early signs of recovery where activities and number of transactions So that’s good to see. But there are still quite far away from the kind of the pre crisis level. If we look at Sweden, we have also performed good in Sweden. We are growing the book in Sweden.
And house prices has has had a flat development during this year. And we can see that on the activity side that we are picking up a bit, but there are still quite quite far far from the kind of pre crisis level in Sweden as well. And then last, then Norway is, I think, where we see the biggest momentum in terms of macro market. So stable mortgage market, increased house prices in in 2025, and activities at a very good level. And we have also seen a good performance in Norway from a growth perspective.
So by that, I hand over to Pontos.
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: Thank you, Bjorn. So let’s walk through the financials. So again, lending to public reached 29,600,000,000.0, which is 9.3% last 12 growth. Net interest margins have remained stable to last year and stable to the first quarter, 4.2% posted in the Q2, which is a slight improvement to same period last year. Strong adjusted operating profit, SEK 177,000,000 and also adjusted operating profit less tax, 141,000,000, both up 38% year on year.
This is driven from strong growth, loan book growth of 9.3% and stable margins. We’ve seen a development with flat OpEx and stable credit losses. And then also in the second quarter, we had favorable outcome of net financial transactions as well, which are mark to market items. They supported roughly EUR 50,000,000 positive to the operating result. And we also had a negative item that relates to the acquisition of the remaining shares in E.
J. Doms Finance, where we made a small impairment of EUR 4,500,000.0 in the second quarter. Credit losses have remained stable and low. So they came down in the second quarter, posted EUR 11,000,000, 24% basis points in credit loss level last twelve months. And again, from the first quarter, where we had some one off items relating to the Bank two portfolio that was acquired, which amounted to SEK 12,000,000 in the first quarter.
Then we’ve seen the costincome ratio improved to 44%. We’re very pleased with that. Again, good growth, stable margins and flat OpEx is obviously the main driver behind that. I think also worth to notice is that the consolidation or the acquisition of the remaining shares in E. J.
And Donsignans means that it’s now a fully or a wholly owned company that is consolidated. So this impacts on a line per line basis. So it inflates OpEx as well as revenue, whereas the bottom line is only marginally impacted. Again, strong return on tangible equity, almost 24% in the quarter and 21% for the first six months this year, driven by two factors: one, obviously, the strong result and secondly, also that the capital structure that was put in place just ahead of the IPO, where we issued AT1 bonds and paid a dividend of SEK $250,000,000 has also been supportive to the return metric. So if we go to the three markets then, let’s start with Sweden.
So I mean, the economic recovery in Sweden is clearly slow and more dragged out following the crisis, though we are seeing early signs of increased activities on the housing market. Prices are stabilizing, but definitely, transaction volumes are almost returning kind of pre crisis levels, which is good to see. For that, we have seen new lending increase. So we have seen the activity increase as well. New lending is up 24% year on year.
And we saw the loan book increase by 4% last twelve months in Sweden. Margins have remained stable around 4% in Sweden, and OpEx is actually down to last year, 2%, which means that we have improved the costincome ratio to 50% on the Swedish market. In the quarter, we do have positive credit losses, which is due to release of provisions of approximately SEK 10,000,000 following improved quality and model recalibrations also. So this brings us down to the bottom line, SEK 74,000,000, which is up 32% to same period last year. So very strong performance in the Swedish market in spite of slower economic recovery.
If we go to Norway, again, strong economy, definitely Norway. The housing market has very strong. House prices are up 7% year on year. We believe that the kind of the lift of the loan to value cap from 85% to 90% is supportive to that. And Norilsbank have also now delivered a first rate cut in June, which all else which should be supportive to continuous growth in the Norwegian market.
Loan book reached EUR 15,700,000,000.0, which is 11% up in local currency year on year. We’ve seen the net interest margin stable or slightly improving compared to last year, where net interest income is up 16%. And this also means that we’ve improved the costincome ratio to 46%, which is driven by, again, strong growth, but also from the full takeout of synergies from the acquisition of Bank2 in early twenty twenty five. And also that we run a very efficient model in terms of customer acquisition in Norway with a broad broker network. The net credit losses in Norway are up, and the share of Stage three loans remain elevated.
It did even come up a little bit in the second quarter compared to the first quarter, which is what affects the credit loss line. So we have made additional provisions for the Norwegian book. But in spite of that, the kind of bottom line or adjusted operating profit, 69,000,000, is up 21 compared to same period last year. So if we go to Finland, so I mean, clearly, recession is gradually residing, but there are early signs from improved activity on the housing market, and that is from extremely suppressed levels, one should say. We’ve seen a continuous very strong growth on the Finnish market.
New lending is up 27% year on year. And the loan book grew to SEK 1,600,000,000.0, which is 57% in local currency. OpEx is actually down to last year. And the costincome ratio has, therefore, improved. It now sits at 100% roughly for the second quarter.
And we are on we are approaching a breakeven point as we have communicated earlier. So on the credit loss side, in comparing starting in the upper left hand corner, comparing I think generally, what we’re seeing is that we’re seeing write offs increasing following previous year’s provisions, which is, again, as expected. So we had $38,500,000 in write offs in the first half of the year 2025. Keeping in mind that 12,000,000 out of those $38,000,000 are of more one off characters stemming from the acquisition of Bank two. So if you adjust for that, it sits on a similar level as we saw in 2024.
And again, we did increase provisions a little bit this year, primarily driven by adverse trend on Stage three loans and then quite concentrated to the market as well, a small uptick in provision, 8,700,000.0, whereas recoveries remain relatively stable to what we’ve seen over the years. Again, Stage three loans, a little bit further up, 7.3%, closing June. On the other hand, we have seen Stage two loans decrease, so they’re just under 10% now. And this is primarily concentrated to the Swedish market, where we’re seeing positive stage migrations. Credit loss level, again, remained stable, 24 basis points over the last twelve months comparing to same period last year, 22 basis points.
Sweden, again, zero due to the fact that we did have provision releases of circa €10,000,000 in the second quarter this year. And the coverage ratios, they remain also stable, actually a little bit up. So we have 4.5% coverage ratio on the Stage three loans and then a little bit up on the Stage two loans and combined 3.3% for Stage two and Stage three. So let’s talk about the funding side. A very stable liability side of the balance sheet.
We have funded the growth of the balance sheet by deposits, which have been pricing very efficient or effectively in the market, and we’ve raised deposits in all three currencies. Capital markets are stable and well functioning. We haven’t done anything last twelve months on the capital markets, and we expect to return to the markets again now during autumn as we have a covered bond maturity in the fourth quarter this year of 2,000,000,000. As we have previously announced, Moody’s issued or revised their rating to be a one and with stable outlook, which was which we expected to happen as well following following the I mean, two things basically. I mean, putting a new capital structure in place as well as slightly adverse trend on the Stage three loans.
We haven’t noted anything that’s been negative on that in terms of markets and pricing, etcetera, or nor has it impacted our covered bond rating. So that is remains one notch down to AAA. In terms of regulatory ratios, we comply well, obviously, with LCR and NSR. So we’re well above the regulatory required levels. And then finally, on the capital ratio side.
So again, we did put a optimized capital structure in place ahead of the IPO, where we issued EUR $250,000,000 in AT1 bonds, and we paid a dividend of EUR $250,000,000, which reduced the CET1 ratio. In the second quarter or June, we posted 14.7% in CET1 ratio, which is in the upper band of the target range, 200 to 300 basis points above the regulatory level. And also on the total capital ratio side, 18.2%, also that’s two twenty basis points above regulatory required level. Have early June, we have received a permission or a decision from the SFSA where we can we can include additional FX risk under the exemption due to its strategic nature, which will have a positive impact on the ratios and the risk exposure amount as we go forward. We expect that to reduce risk exposure amount with circa SEK 500,000,000, which will improve the CET1 efficiency with approximately 40 basis points.
So with that, I hand back
Bjorn Lander, CEO, Energy Holdings: to Thank you, Pontos. We talk a bit about the financial targets, which also was communicated during the spring. So we have three targets. They are equally important. The first one is about the loan book.
We have a target to grow the loan book by approximately 8% to 10% over business cycle. And we can clearly see in the second quarter, it sits where it should, so 9.3% adjusted for currency. The second one is about the adjusted return on tangible equity, and we have a target to be at and around approximately 20%. We have delivered a little bit more than that during the ’25 as well as the second quarter. So almost 24% in the second quarter and 21% for the first half.
And the last target is about capitalization and have a strong CET1. And we have a target to have a 200 to 300 basis points above the regulatory levels. And at June, we are at 14.7%, which means we are two seventy basis points above the regulatory requirements. So all in all, very, very good to see that we deliver in line with targets or slightly ahead. So final remarks here.
So short summary, I’m very pleased with the development of Energy Holding and the bank. We have seen a very solid loan book growth driven by all markets, would say, which is very good to see. And we should keep in mind that we still believe that we have relatively weak mortgage markets, especially then in Finland and Sweden. Very strong adjusted operating profit, very good to see. And that’s partly done, thanks to improved cost to income ratio coming from the transformation that has been ongoing for quite some time.
And again, financial targets met. If we look a little bit ahead, what’s going to happen? I mean, we are keen to grow the company. So we will continue to focus growing the loan book organically. We continue to see good momentum across all markets.
And then a key focus for us is to continue to drive efficiency, continue to work hard with automation, improving the customer experience to make it easier for our customers. That will help us to to convert more more in the future. And then, of course, adapt to new technology, AI, and what have you. And I think we we have proven that our model and business is resilient. So despite ongoing kind of geopolitical conflicts, macroeconomic challenges, we have performed very strongly.
And we also think that kind of recent regulatory proposal will have a very positive effect for Energy, particularly those supporting first time buyers, including easing of amortization requirements and also the higher loan to value proposed in Sweden. So all in all, well positioned for the future. And by that, we open up for any questions.
Conference Moderator: The next question comes from Patrick Bratellis from ABG. Please go ahead.
Patrick Bratellis, Analyst, ABG: Good morning. Thank you for the presentation. I’m going to start off where you ended on financial targets. Since this is your first quarterly report and you’re already at all of your financial targets, how is your view on raising your target to raise the ambition bar?
Bjorn Lander, CEO, Energy Holdings: Yes. Hello, good morning. No, I think we will stick to our target. As we said, we delivered well in line for the second quarter. I think we remain at the same target for now, and we’ll continue to develop the bank and expect to continue to deliver in line with the targets in the near to midterm.
Patrick Bratellis, Analyst, ABG: Okay. Fair enough. Shortly after the IPO, Sweden put forward some new proposal for amortization requirements and increased LTV. Can you talk about how you expect this will impact you?
Bjorn Lander, CEO, Energy Holdings: Yes. I mean, if it will go all the way and come into force next year, we believe it will have a positive impact on energy in Sweden, particularly for first time buyers since they proposed to increase the loan to value from 85% to 90%, similar what happened in Norway in the beginning of this year. And as Pontus mentioned, we believe that, that has had also a positive impact on the Norwegian market as well as energy in Norway. So overall, we are positive to the proposed changes.
Patrick Bratellis, Analyst, ABG: Okay. Fair enough. Thank you. And there was a one off in this quarter naturally following the IPO. But should we think that, that is one thing for the past?
Or is it something that will also continue in the coming quarter that has not been taking already that you already now know? Or how should we think about that?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: Yes. So we have like noted, we have 63,000,000 of of one or four adjusted expenses or IACs in the quarter that is relating to the to the to the IPO process, and we had or it’s a 180,000,000 for for the full year. I think what we touching to that, what we have going forward, which is also disclosed in the report, is that there are certain incentives that were put in place as part of the IPO process, and those will have an impact on the P and L as we go forward, most likely. And that can be yes, that can be seen in the notes to the financial statements. But besides that, we don’t expect to have any adjusting items for any restructurings or anything like that.
I think those are all behind ourselves.
Patrick Bratellis, Analyst, ABG: That is fair. And my last question is given that NII is the majority of the income side here. In connection to the IPO and in your prospectus, you discussed net interest margin between 3.54%. You’re now at like 4.1. Can you talk a little bit when do you expect to arrive at the middle of this range?
And do you expect to see stable margins going forward in the coming quarters? Or how should we think about that?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: I think I mean, we I mean, for the kind of the medium term guidance, we remain what we communicated earlier, like you pointed out. And I think I mean, in terms of rate environment and rate cut, I think we’ve had most of that in terms of SEK and euro that is behind us. I mean there might come another rate cap, but it’s material. So in terms of liquidity positions, etcetera, that shouldn’t be very kind of compressing the margins going forward. And obviously, Norway, we expect to see rates come down, but it will probably take some time before they’re down to normalized levels.
That can put some pressure on the NIM going forward. So I think overall, I think we remain with the guidance that we expect it maybe to be in the middle of the range over the, say, the coming three years now.
Conference Moderator: The next question comes from Andreas Heikkinen from SEB. And
Andreas Heikkinen, Analyst, SEB: I guess I should say congratulations on a good start of your life as a listed company. Could we just go back a little bit to NII? A few smaller questions. One is that you say that you were able to offset the falling interest rates by repricing both assets and liabilities. That is then more related, I guess, in SEK and ECB rates.
And would you expect that to be tougher in Norway? Is that what I should read into your reply just now?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: No. I I think not necessarily, but I think, I mean, there’s there’s obviously, I mean, some parts of the liquidity, etcetera, that will will come under pressure on the on the lower on on the lower rate level. So I think that’s that’s one. That’s the part that you should into it. And I think then also, I think we have generally, over the years and also now, we are generally seeing a trend where we’re underwriting, if you like, the nearer prime type of loans, which has a slightly lower margin than what the back book sits.
So I think there is an element of margin compression there as well.
Andreas Heikkinen, Analyst, SEB: Okay. Not competition, but mix. That’s fine. Then also on NII. On the funding side, you’re right that SEK 2,000,000,000 of covered bond maturing in Q4.
So two questions related to that. One is, will that be replaced with new issues? And if not, given that you have a high NSFR and LCR, could you actually live without that and using your deposits? And that should then be quite an improvement in your funding costs. And also on cover, any news on potentially issuing in Norway?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: Yes. I think we I mean, in terms of refinancing, I mean, we’ll probably use multiple sources as we normally do on the diversified. But I mean, of it will clearly be that we want to return to the capital markets with that. And we don’t think that, that should be kind of negative overall for the net interest income. In terms of the covered in Norway, that is not part of what will happen at least this year as we’ve communicated earlier on.
So I think that’s more for 2026 and onwards then. But clearly, something that we focus on continuing to diversify the funding base.
Andreas Heikkinen, Analyst, SEB: Perfect. And then just one small technical question. You had a very high tax rate. And I understand it’s related to Norway and FX. But could you tell us what should we be looking at going forward as a more normal tax rate?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: I think you should I mean, normal tax rate would obviously be the blend of the profit across the markets. And Finland is loss making, so that’s not quite, I mean, 20% tax rate in Sweden and then 25% in Norway and the blend of that. And roughly, the profits are split equally. I think what impacts the or think what is the impact is kind of tax and timing on how you can remove Norwegian taxes in Sweden. I think that is the one that puts some upward pressure on the effective tax rate as we do not recognize that as a deferred tax asset.
Conference Moderator: The next question comes from Amre Prinzel from Nordea. I
Amre Prinzel, Analyst, Nordea: have a question in terms of loan loss ratios and credit losses. How much of the loan losses in Norway can be traced back to the BANK2 acquisition? Like how much is from their balance sheet, if I may put it like that?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: Yes. I think there’s I mean it’s a good question. I mean there’s like mentioned, there’s EUR 12,000,000 in write offs this year that stems back from the acquisition of Bank two then. Those are more of kind of one off character as we reported in the first quarter. But I think it’s not I think we’ve seen a similar trend, I would say, on the Bank two or the previous Bank two portfolio as well as the entity portfolio.
So it’s kind of split as a portfolio split, I guess, you could say. So there’s like billion dollars out of the total booking over relates to Bank two and the remainder. So in terms of stage migrations, etcetera, it’s a similar pattern between the two in terms of movement.
Amre Prinzel, Analyst, Nordea: Thank you. And how much did items finance way down the cost to income ratio? Would you say I mean, on bottom line, I understand it’s marginal, but just to have sort of an understanding on the cost adjusted cost to income?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: No, I think it’s around one percentage points in the quarter. And I think if you annualize I mean, on a fully annualized basis, we expect it to weigh down at approximately four percentage points as it is an EBITDA business, basically. So I mean, it naturally has much higher cost income ratio. So that, I think, is the impact we expect to see from it.
Amre Prinzel, Analyst, Nordea: Thank you. And lastly, I guess, is difficult to say, but do you know approximately how large is your exposure to the North Parts of Sweden where some large companies such as Norfolk have had defaults and then there are some assets there?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: No. I don’t I don’t I can’t answer that, you know, right off. We’ll to come back on that one. But I think generally
Amre Prinzel, Analyst, Nordea: That’s fine. That a long shot for me.
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: As a general comment, I guess, you could say, I mean, like, we’ve I think we’re typically we’re concentrated in the greater kind of the greater city areas, like but not the realest central part, Stockholm, Gothenburg and Malmo and then kind of, if you like, university cities around Sweden. So we’re typically I mean, it’s low I mean, it’s low density in the North Of Sweden as a general note. And it’s nothing that we’ve noted that it should have had a major negative impact or anything like that.
Conference Moderator: Question comes from Patrick Bratellis from ABG. Please go ahead.
Patrick Bratellis, Analyst, ABG: Thank you. Yes, one follow-up question from me again. On the loan loss side, some banks usually talk about seasonality on the loan loss line and where Q1 and Q4 are seasonally higher, while Q2 and Q3 are seasonally lower. Can you talk about any seasonality on your loan loss slide? What should we expect there?
Pontus Sardal, CFO, Energy Holdings: I think generally, I mean, there’s obviously some elements of seasonality in terms of arrears and things like that, that they’re typically concentrated around the major weekends like Christmas, etcetera, Easter and so on. But I think I wouldn’t say that we see a huge kind of swing in loss levels over the quarter. But arrears definitely can vary. But then normally, it’s quite yes, it’s quite stable over the year.
Conference Moderator: There are no more phone questions at this time. So I hand the conference back to the speakers for any written questions or closing comments.
Bjorn Lander, CEO, Energy Holdings: All right. There are no other questions, what I have noticed. So again, thank you for participating during this Q2 earning call, and see you soon again.
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