Earnings call transcript: Shelly Group reports strong Q2 2025 growth, plans expansion

Shelly Group SE (SHLY), with a market capitalization of $3.53 billion, reported robust financial performance in Q2 2025, with revenue growth of 29.6%, contributing to a total first-half revenue growth of 54%, surpassing the company’s target of 52.8%. The company continues to demonstrate resilience with 30 consecutive quarters of growth, despite facing currency exchange challenges. According to InvestingPro data, the company maintains impressive gross profit margins of 100% and a healthy current ratio of 1.02, indicating strong operational efficiency. Shelly Group is also expanding its market presence with new product launches and strategic office openings in Europe.

Key Takeaways

• Revenue growth of 29.6% in Q2, leading to a 54% increase in the first half of 2025.
• Expansion plans include new offices in the UK and Benelux and a manufacturing facility in Bulgaria.
• Introduction of Generation 4 devices and upcoming product launches at the IFA event.

Company Performance

Shelly Group’s performance in Q2 2025 reflects its sustained growth trajectory, with a notable 29.6% increase in revenue, following a 29.3% rise in Q1. The company has achieved 30 consecutive quarters of growth, underscoring its strong market position. Key regions such as the DACH area and the rest of Europe have shown significant growth, with the latter expanding by 31.7%. The Rest of the World segment saw an impressive 83.7% growth, driven by strong performances in Italy, the Nordics, and the UK.

Financial Highlights

• Revenue: Increased by 29.6% in Q2 2025.
• EBIT: Impacted by €1.6 million due to currency exchange issues.
• Adjusted EBIT margins: 24% in Q2, down from 26.9% in Q1.
• Equity ratio: Strong at 81%.

Outlook & Guidance

Shelly Group maintains its guidance for 2025 and 2026, anticipating 40% growth in Q3 and 50% in Q4. Trading at a P/E ratio of 11.45, the company projects potential revenue of around €150 million for 2025, with plans to sell 12-13 million devices. Strategic initiatives include expanding its European market presence and preparing for significant product launches at the upcoming IFA event.

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Executive Commentary

• Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, emphasized, "We are making your home smart. We are making companies smart," highlighting the company’s commitment to innovation.
• Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, stated, "We develop the market. And the people asking, working for our devices," reflecting the company’s focus on market expansion and customer engagement.
• Kirsch also noted, "All numbers show in the right direction," underscoring confidence in the company’s growth trajectory.

Risks and Challenges

• Currency exchange fluctuations, which have already impacted EBIT by €1.6 million.
• Potential challenges in scaling manufacturing capabilities with the new facility in Bulgaria.
• Market competition and pricing strategies, particularly with major players like Amazon.

Q&A

During the earnings call, analysts inquired about the company’s challenges with Amazon’s pricing strategies, the low adoption rate of the Matter standard, and plans for local team expansions. Executives also addressed concerns regarding the potential impact of lower dollar exchange rates on future earnings.

Full transcript - Shelly Group AD (SLYG) Q2 2025:

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Morning, ladies and gentlemen, and a warm welcome to today’s earnings call of the Shelley Group SE. Following the publication of the unaudited half year figures of 2025 and giving a business update. I’m delighted to welcome the co CEOs, Dimitar Dimitrov and Wolfgang Kirsch, who will speak in a moment and guide us through the presentation and the results. After the presentation, we will move on to a q and a session in which you will be allowed to place your question to the management. So let’s jump straight into the figures.

Mister Kirsch, this stage is yours.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yes. Good morning, everybody, and welcome to the first half earnings call twenty twenty five. And welcome as well on behalf of Dimitar Dimitrov, who’s next to me. And as usual, we will lead you through numbers. I will start with some general updates and some general numbers.

Then Dimitrov will talk about products, what will come, what happened, and some activation things that are really interesting. And then I will lead you through the detailed financials and some previews for the end of this year. Just a reminder for the newcomers, we are a smart home company or a smart business company. We are making your home smart. We are making companies smart.

We are making solar business smart. We help to save energy. That’s what we are doing, and that’s a thrilling business, and that is continuing to grow. Some highlights from the first half of the year. We grew our installed base.

We have now 2,300,000 or more than 2,300,000 users of our cloud. We increased that number by 800,000 in the last twelve months. We are in more than 4,900,000 households. That’s always a bit of an estimation because we don’t we cannot measure exactly the households, but the cloud users. We grew that by around about 1,600,000 in the last twelve months.

The first Celli was sold in 02/2018, and since 02/2018, we sold 2,600,000 devices in total and 11,500,000 in the last twelve months only. That’s really amazing figures. That starts to be a really important customer base, and that starts as well to unlock our software as a service business so that opens doors for future businesses with monetizing the data that we have, monetizing the customer connections that we have. And that is something that we look more and more at, and it starts to be one of our key objectives. Some other highlights.

The financials, revenue is above target in the first half of the year. EBIT is on target in the first half of the year. The growth in all regions is above the market. Always a bit complicated to say how strong the market grew. We estimate something between 1015%.

In some regions, it might even be below the 10%. As I said, always complicated to get some numbers, but that’s the best estimates that we have. In distribution, we once again onboarded new distributors, new distribution channels in DIY as well as in the professional business. And about the professional business, a very important and something we are really proud of is our installer network that is growing. You might know that we started that a bit more than a year ago.

At 2024, we had 900 installers onboarded. June this year, we are more than two thousand five four hundred, sorry. And I can tell you that in the quarters, we will be able to report higher numbers because currently, it’s growing very fast. And that shows that our products are more and more appreciated in the professional segment as well, and that’s something that we were working hard and that that starts to pay back now. Customer ownership, that’s about the the numbers that I showed you before.

But beside having more addressable customers that that use our application and, of course, a strong increase in the premium app. Dimitar will talk about the number of activations in the cloud of devices in our cloud. That’s something that gives a promising outlook for the next six months as well. Last time, for the first time, we talked about verticals. You know that we are already quite strong and seen as as a platform in the solar business, but beside this, we are talking with other potential verticals.

And one is motors. That is the really at the source. That’s the guys that build the motors for garage doors, not the garage doors, so it’s one level before. Or the motors for shading systems. We are in good progress.

We have a couple of very good contacts. Everyone is is happy about the progress of work. It will take some time, but that’s on an excellent way. With the insurances, I have to say that will take longer because they have very long decision cycles. That’s still very early stage, but everyone says that is amazing what we could do, how the insurance could save money, how the user of the insurance could save money.

Let’s talk about that, and then it takes a long time. On the security systems, we are, for a longer time, already in certification process with the big American security companies. This is for most of them, this is already finished. And in the last couple of weeks and months, we got a very good visibility about our Z Wave long range products in The US. We are in a lot of magazines, specialized magazines.

And since then, we have a higher attention from from all those guys. We are in test processes, so we hope that this will pay back as well in the next year. And something that is new is energy contracts, electricity contracts. Using our database, we are in in very good contact with energy providers and with energy platforms. Of course, we will do this in the DACH region first where we have the highest density of customer data.

And with this information, we can really tailor made offer and sell electricity contracts to customers because we know how much they consume. We know what they consume it for and when exactly during the day they consume it for us. So we we can make some tailor made offers. First test is is will start end of this year, beginning of next year, but looks very promising, and everyone is happy about the data that we can provide in this regards. Couple of of days or weeks ago, we we published that we have made an the first cobranded deal with one of our big partners in solar business.

EcoFlow is a company based in California and in China. They bought and will continue buying two of our devices, the Pro three m and our Shelli Plaque, and we’ll bundle this worldwide in all their regions with their solar systems to have a better energy management system, and that is something that we expect to come from other partners as well. So that’s the next step, if you want, in the vertical of solar business. So now about the numbers. All numbers show in the right direction.

In the first quarter, we grew our revenue 29.3%, so roundabout 30%. The EBIT only grew 12.6%, but it’s in in the frame on the level of the expectations for a quarter that is not one of the strongest quarters. We were hit by some currency exchange issues coming from the weak dollar. We lost €1,600,000 on that. If we would make a currency adjustment with the dollar euro exchange rate, our EBIT margin in the first half of the year would be on 25.4%, so even above the expectations.

Where is this coming from? This comes from our very early payments or prepayments of orders that we have still done with a with a higher dollar. Now that the dollar is is lower when the products arrive, we have to reevaluate the products and the prepayments, and that leads to this 1,600,000. We do not expect that this continues in the second half of the year, but we have some positive counter effects in the second half of the year. I will come back to this later.

And the last number is something that we are specifically proud of. You know that we worked a lot in the last months on cash improvement and on free cash flow improvement. We have made a very good jump in cash, mainly coming from free flow from operations sorry, free cash flow from operations. And you will see more details in the second part of my presentation. So all numbers are going in the right directions.

There is no weak spot, so we are quite confident. We are happy about the first half of the year, and we look positive in the second. And now I pass to Dimitar to talk a bit about products before I come back with information about more detailed numbers.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Thank you very much, Wolfgang. Welcome to everybody. Let’s talk about the products and show what we do and what we’re planning for for the for the second half of the year. As you can see, for the first half of the year, we already released, more than 30, yeah, 32 products, which is a 19 update it’s it’s product updates because we are strongly working on the generation for the latest generation of the O Shelley devices. But, also, we released 13 new products completely on the market, which is not exist before, which support our growth.

And this is not everything because the big portion is coming now. We keep a a huge a new really amazing new products and new releases for EFA because we wanna present them with this huge event. This is our, how to say, our home event. In in Germany, even it’s a worldwide event where we wanna present the the latest technology, the products which is we we talk about it with them for them before, but they really it’s a it’s a game changer for some of the smart home directions. Something which is also important that you can see that how the generation and the new products is coming into the market.

For on twenty twenty twenty two, the most use the most selling and most use used product is a generation one. Then we slowly start penetrating on the market for the generation two of our devices. 2024, we’re generation three, and now that this year, we can see that the generation four is coming on top. How this help us? Because the every new generation adds something else.

They it’s adding the the new protocols which can be used, the new not only the new devices, but especially the new integrations which can be done with our devices. Because now, just imagine that new generation one support just the Wi Fi, generation two support just the Wi Fi and Bluetooth. The generation three support not only Wi Fi and Bluetooth, but different kind of the add ons and the WARA and other other things now out of the box, the generation four support Wi Fi Bluetooth, ZigBee technology. On the top of that, we have four g and WARA add ons to each of our each of our devices, which, by the way, make our devices compatible with almost everything and anyhow automation worldwide. Something else which is very important.

Beside the sales, the the the we are also working or how how is going with the cloud activations because like that, we wanna be sure that we not just fulfill our the the warehouses of our distributors and wholesalers, but also we wanna see that they selling the devices and how the activation is going. What happens, as you can see, even that our growth is below 20 50%, we clearly, we can see that we keep above 50% the daily activation rate for the for the new customer. This is the new devices the new customers usually install devices on a daily base. Also, you can see that our average number compared with the eight eight seven hundred fifth 7,500 now is above, how many? It’s 11,000 average daily activation.

This is the new devices on the on the on the existing and new new households. This is very important number which we’re monitoring, and we know that from where we know that the, how to say, the the share is keep growing, and we we we have much more penetration on the market. What happens? That’s something which, also we show, in in the previous call. Now in the q three, we already and on the EFA, this is the partially what we show the very shortly.

This is the the first share power strip, the the very amazing power presence sensor with the positioning of the people and the multi person positioning, counting, and and targeting. Then the the the something which we never show until now, but the code name is the Excel display, the new multimedia point of the in central control display for the house. The ultrasonic sensor, something which is a lots of very long time is is the customer’s asking us because they wanna measure the different kind of the liquid levels or presence, but with ultrasonic detection. And some others which wanna keep them hide them because we never present it, and we prepare the huge event in Ifa where we pre where where we show it. And for the q four, we’re still on target and still working for the for the new pro series, the generation four, which we’re targeting to be VD certified, completely VD certified.

The camera line, which we talked about, the new cameras is on progress and working on that. The bulbs and different kind of the additional device which we’re working on, which I don’t want to share now because this will take a lot of the time. Yeah. Now I wanna go back to the Volgren with the financial advice. Thank you, Volgren.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. Yeah. So you see that most of the products, at least, are coming that we promised before, and that gives us some tailwind for the second half of the year. Just to remind you, as usual, there was the chart that I showed before. All numbers are going in the right direction.

Revenue growing, EBIT growing. With the small effect in currency, the EBIT would even be above our targets and way above the targets for this quarter, above the target for the year. And our cash is increasing and coming from a better management of our working capital. So now if we go into the quarters, you see that first quarter, we were growing roundabout 29%, second quarter, the same speed. For the second quarter, we planned a growth rate of 30%.

We landed at 29.6%, so that’s almost on the point. But in the first half of the year, if we take the two quarters accumulated, we plan to grow 52.8% and we are or to reach 52.8 we are on 54%, so a little bit above. Just a side note, something that is completely normal for us, but it’s not normal for other companies, we have now 30 quarters in a row of growth. And this is something that is really amazing, and, of course, we plan to continue this record. So let’s see if we reach 60 or above without any fallback in in revenue.

We are at least working on that. On the EBIT side, both both quarters growing in EBIT. Second quarter, if we take the EBIT with this the side effect that was higher in Q2 than it was in Q1 of the currency exchange rate issue because more products were coming in that we already prepaid before at the lower price. But if we take the adjusted EBIT margins, it’s 26.9 for the first quarter, and it’s 24% in the second quarter. We confirm the annual target of ’25, so we are on a perfect way towards that.

And we think, especially with higher revenues that we plan for the second quarter that we already announced beginning of the year, and we have some we have less currency effects, and we have positive currency effects coming from lower cost of goods that will support a strong EBIT margin in the second half of the year. The regional split, the DACH region, our biggest region growing above 20%. You know that the region is is at least was beginning of the year not in a very good shape in general. The economic situation was a little bit stressed. It looks better now.

So it looks that the economy in Germany is coming back. All signs are more positive, but first half of the year is over. We grew 20%. That is, from our point of view, significantly above the market, at least twice the market, maybe three times the market. The DACH share of revenue now is a little bit below 50%.

That’s as well planned because, of course, with all the efforts we are doing in other regions, they have to catch up. Rest of Europe grew 31, almost 32%. Share now is 45.6%. And this is mainly supported by Italy and Nordics where we have on a on a good level already, especially in Italy, a very nice growth rate, so very high growth rates. The UK is performing over proportionally, but still on a low level.

We are still not having our team on board, the full team on board in The UK. We have one person. We see that this brings some effects, but we want to invest more. We just have a problem to find the right people there. Rest of the world, huge jump, 83.7%.

That’s a huge increase, mainly coming from Asia and and a bit from Australia. United States is as well growing in the same speed as the group. But I have to say that we still are on a low level here, and we still see this opportunistic. So this is not our key focus. Our key focus is in Europe.

That’s where we want to continue growing and whatever we can take from the rest of the world. And if it continues like that, of course, we are more than happy. But that’s nothing that is that’s really planable and that that we think we should focus on. Now the cash flow bridge or the cash bridge. If you look to the the number of of cash flow from operations, we increased that, and that is the the main message here.

We increased that versus last year by €6,200,000 That is an amazing achievement. That is the first result from all the small measures that we are taking, and we are definitely not at the end with that. We are just at the beginning to optimize our working capital level and to really work on all the details that will take a longer time. But it’s a very good achievement. We invested roundabout 2,100,000.0 in r and d, 1,900,000.0 more than last year total investments, and the rest of the numbers are more or less on a normal level.

If you ask yourself why FX rate here is only 300,000 instead of the 1.6 that I mentioned before, that’s the cash effect. The other effect is not a cash effect. It’s coming from the cash effect. That’s why this is mentioned here in the in the cash bridge, in the in the cash flow overview. So all very nice.

We are still on an equity ratio of 81%. That is amazing. I don’t think that there are that much companies out there with those numbers. Just an update on this chart. We have working capital measures on the way for the last six, nine months.

The measures itself did not change. We make some progress in most of them. And as I said before, we are definitely not where we wanna be. We see some first good results, and we see that it will take some time. So I would say one to one and a half years to really reach a very good level on on in all these points.

One example, more shipments using sea freight that would would reduce our cost of goods by 1%, maybe even 2% or increase the margin on that level. We are not able to do that because we have still hiccups with production, with chip availability. It’s it’s a bit last minute. The certifications take longer time, so we we did not make big movements there. That’s a reserve of one or 2% that we will have in maybe in in one and a half years and not earlier.

We try some things already, but it’s not it’s not that easy. So on a good way, but still takes some time. And we are not in a in an overhurry because we do not want to risk revenues just optimizing the stock. So what we have achieved now, we are super happy, and that will continue. So that’s some more detailed numbers from the p and l.

I don’t want to go in all the lines, just two, three things. I already mentioned the EBIT margin effect or the EBIT effect with the adjusted EBIT. There is something similar that we could do. I’m not a big fan of adjustments. That’s that’s that always needs too much ex explanations.

Just the 1.6 are significant and coming from FX that I cannot change. There is another 1,600,000 that is coming from revenue effects. If you remember, we have changed contracts with our distributors in the last year, end of last year for the last quarter. That leads to a different accounting of bonuses, and that leads to an effect that is in that is visible in EBIT and sorry, in revenue and in the gross margin. If we would take this effect out, make an adjustment for that, so really look at the like for like or comparable comparison, our growth rate would not be 29.3, it would be 31 33.1% growth.

So now we have these these changes, so we have to report to ’29 point three. But if we would make everything comparable, it’s 33.1% growth. Higher marketing costs, sales and marketing costs mainly coming from quite high investments in third party marketing spend. So for example, our UK distributor went to two trade shows already with a very big presence of Shelley, making us visible in The UK market that’s not paying back immediately. We were on some trade shows in in in Italy and then other regions of of Europe and of the world did something in Asia.

That that is now an investment in the future and will hopefully balance a little bit out. But it’s not something that is really significant, but it’s quite a high investment. The premium app, you see that the premium app in the first half of the year in comparison with first half of the year last year 2024 grew by 145%. That’s a really huge jump. I repeat myself, we are doing this in a very careful way because there are not a lot of good examples in the market with successful paid versions of smart home applications.

It’s really easy to get a shit storm here from customers, and and we are not in a hurry, but we see that this takes off. And why is then the revenue only growing 79%? That has two reasons. One reason is that all our customers has have a free trial period of three months. So this will will come to the the 149% or the a lot of the new customers will start paying in three months.

And the second reason is that a lot of our customers decided to pay once a year, not every month. In the last year, we booked this in the month when they paid. Now this year, we do this in the way as it correctly should be done. We make deferred bookings. So the the effect in the revenue and in the EBIT is is visible, not when the customer pays, but over the distributed over the twelve months that follows.

So that’s a a a an effect that is delayed, and that will grow over time. But we feel very comfortable with reaching the €1,000,000 revenue. And as you know, most of this is is 100% profit in this year and to continue growing in in the planned speed in the next year. So that’s very positive, and that’s one of the first thing where we can monetize money and come to recurring revenue models. EBITA showed this pipeline already.

I will not go into details. Just to repeat that this supports, of course, our higher revenue growth for q three and q four. Beginning of the year, we already said that q four, we expect 40% sorry, q three, forty percent q four, fifty percent. On top of this, we opened our Polish office in May. There are not big effects visible now, but we expect some effects in the second half of the year.

We are planning to open in q three offices with with sales teams in The UK and in Benelux, and hopefully, until the end of the year as well in Iberia, so that we have more people on the ground because we see that this really pays back. We have a couple of challenges, and we have more opportunities. Challenges are more short term. We have some shortages of key components. So one example, there is a US company delivering a chip that is like 60¢ or 70¢, so not significant, but we need it for power metering.

And they decided beginning of the year with of course, without asking us, they decided to reduce their production capacity because of all these ups and downs with with tariffs and the the things that mister Trump is doing. Now we are suffering because we wanted to increase our our delivery or our orders from them. This is not possible, so we will get not the number of of power metering components that we need. That mainly reflects on revenue of one key product that is used from the solar industry mainly. We could easily sell a 100,000 pieces more.

Average price of this product is €50 to distributors roundabout. So you can make your mathematics. That’s revenue that we will not make this year and that we will compensate with something else. The negative exchange rates that we had beginning of the year, no one really knows where the dollar goes. We try to secure as much as we can, but we prepay our devices three, sometimes six months ahead, and we don’t know where the dollar stands.

But we do not expect that this continues in the second half of the year, but there’s a that’s a challenge. We have a more and more complicated certification process that delays products because being present in Asia, being present in Australia, in The United States, in Canada, in Europe, having META certifications. META certification is a real headache for us because that they are so slow. That delays the processes. That’s not something that is that’s that’s really super positive, but we have to live with that.

And it increases, of course, the costs. We have a challenge with one key customer. I mentioned that in the first quarter already. That did not change. That’s not that small distributor worldwide active that some of you might know, headquartered in Seattle, starts with a big a.

We could easily push revenues by opening the doors and saying yes to everything that they want, but they are hungry like like a lion. So they ask more and more and more and more, and we stopped to we stopped stopped to say yes to everything, so we are in a real dispute. First half of the year, the revenue with these guys reduced enormously. But if as you as you have seen, our revenue grew 30%, so we are compensating all of that or most of that with other channels that are super happy that our product’s not not that strong on this channel anymore. That is something that we will see where this leads, and it’s nothing that we can or we could change.

We could boost our revenue short term, but long term, mid term, we would have a negative effect. Regional expansion, I already said we need to keep people that that we still do not find everywhere, but we feel that we are on a good way. On the opportunity side, midterm, something in the second half of the year already. We improve our sourcing and we negotiate better with with chip manufacturers and others, and we see first results that will have a positive effect on the gross margin. Then the the exchange rate issue that is on the one hand side causing this exchange rate problems will, in the second half of the year, pay back with lower cost of goods because we’re having 10 lower dollar.

That means we have a huge opportunity here in increasing decreasing the COGS and with this increasing our gross margin that supports the 25% EBIT goal. And we are we are having the new product categories in the pipeline that that Dimitar already mentioned, so like cameras and a couple of other things that will support the growth in the next year. They are on the horizon. We have with with all the issues we have with this one customer, we have an already an improved channel management, and we we have clear plans and steps how we will further improve that next year. And that that opens a wider range of distributors, and that reduces as well a cluster risk that we have with being strong with a couple of customers only.

That’s that’s not good. Experience shows that local people increase the revenue. It always takes it has a delay. It always takes a bit. We have seen that in Nordics putting the team on the ground.

At the beginning, growth rates were average of the company or a little bit above, and now it it looks like it’s really accelerating, and that’s all positive signs. So short term, some challenges. Midterm, we have more opportunities than challenges, and that is that’s a good sign. So that leads to the summary. We are happy with h one.

Revenue is above target. EBIT is is on target. And once again, if we would make this adjustment even above target or significantly above target, all regions are growing above the market. We have a significant free cash flow improvement, and that’s something that we are really proud. All regions continue to grow above the market.

We have some good progress in in being stronger in the professional market, seeing that more installers come to our platform. We have a delay in some of the products, some coming from from the chip shortage or from other component shortages or from some certifications. But we have a much higher daily activation rate. That was the chart that Dimitar showed. And just just to to make the numbers clear once again, 50% higher daily activation, 30% more revenue in the first quarter.

That’s a clear sign that that products are sold, that the pipelines are not overfilled, and that gives some positive wind for the second half of the year. Premium app above target. And with this, we confirm the ’25 and the ’26 guidance. Some people say we have to increase. We will not.

We keep the guidance, both guidances, as as they are for the time being. We have measures to optimize the working capital that will continue and will pay back in the next twelve, eighteen months. New product categories support the growth in ’25 and ’26. And we have additional product categories that are not yet published that will come soon, hopefully, and that will support especially the the development in the professional business. And that is something that currently no one has in in Europe.

And especially if not on a whole price point, there are some individual products, but this would be really mind blowing. So that’s all. And now open for your questions.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Thank you very much for the presentation, and we will now move on to the q and a session. For a dynamic conversation, we kindly ask you to ask questions in person via the audio line. To do so, click on the raise your hand button. If you have dialed in by phone, please use the key combination star nine followed by star six. And if you do not have the possibility to speak freely, please place your question in the chat box.

We have a first participant with a question on the audio line. Bastian Brahe, you should be able to speak now.

Bastian Brahe, Analyst: Yeah. Thank you, and good morning. So two questions for me. In the last few years, you onboarded several country teams, sales, and also local management, and you said you rather see a gradual improvement in, for example, growth rates, and I expect also margins and not only an immediate effect. So just for better understanding, could you explain the important steps the local teams are doing after being onboarded?

So is it mostly on the partner side where they are expanding faster than before? Or is it also marketing, which plays an important role? But, yeah, could you, like, give us some some explanation or indication how that plan is going after you launched several local teams?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yes. Of course. So first, let me explain what local teams mean or local people mean. So we started a couple of years ago with having the the German office. There, we have a full team for our biggest region.

It’s it’s now more than 10 people, and they do all the local stuff, local training and local language, local marketing, corporations with magazines, with journalists, with influencers. And that really shows that we can keep the growth rates quite high, although we are on a big level. In other countries, we started to onboard one salesperson, like in Italy or in The UK. In some regions, it failed, so we had to take out the people or change the people. In Nordics, we were quite early with first one person, and then we added three more, one for marketing, technical support, and as well for sales.

So now the next step is and that’s what we did in Poland. In Poland, we hired a full team from day one. So we found a country manager with a very good experience who brought people from his network. And there we have that’s that is a typical setup. So we need the country manager.

We then we we need one more salespeople. So we expect the country manager, of course, to make a lot of sales as well. In such a small team, we need someone for marketing to localize all the marketing materials in the local language. So Polish language is important, especially if we wanna go more into the mass market and into the professional market. Because the professional installers, only a few of them speak good enough English, and they don’t wanna talk English if it’s about technical stuff.

So, yes, the the the engineers and the early adopters and the geeks in the market, they speak English, and they they are open to do so. But if you wanna have mass market, you need local people. And the same is is for technical descriptions, so marketing materials, technical descriptions, installer trainings in the local language. But, of course, and that’s what happened with the Polish team, they came couple of weeks after they onboarded with a long list of distributors, where should we present, how should we do our business. And a lot of these guys, we simply don’t know if we sit here in Sofia and and think about the Polish market.

So they have much more knowledge about the market. Same will happen in in The Netherlands and in The UK. In The UK, we have a good distributor, we have a good salesperson, but we need a full team. We need someone for marketing, handling the corporations. In in Germany, we are every day in the newspapers.

We are in computer build in in build, not only computer build, as the best plaque in the market currently. They make a huge campaign for testing products, and we we are in in this category, we are one of the leading brands. And that’s something where you need local people because as well, the journalists don’t wanna talk English. That’s a fact. Now that is a step by step approach.

So now we have two people in Italy. We are looking for one or two more. We had to change, unfortunately, one person in in South Europe as well, but that’s that’s what people typically do. So they are onboarded. We build a small team.

Technical support, marketing, sales, that’s where it starts with, because the backbone, of course, will stay here in Sofia and and, like, accounting and all the other things will be done here.

Bastian Brahe, Analyst: And from a margin perspective, is it like some one or not one up one up cost, but ramp up cost because, of course, local teams with, their salaries and maybe some, marketing to to ramp the efforts, up and then gradual improvement over, I don’t know, one year, one and a half years

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: or half week. Of course, Bastian, this is an this is an investment. So we do not expect that we hire four, five I think we have five people in Poland. Five people invest something in marketing, and the payback comes the next day. But we are not very patient in that.

So we are not known as a company that invests millions in marketing and in teams and countries, and then we wait five years to to have the payback. And they all know that. And we are not starting at zero. So we are known in Poland. So we did, I don’t know, a million euros roundabout in Poland last year.

And with the Polish team on board for six months this year, we expect this to grow, and next year and the year after to grow this significantly because the market volume is is huge. We had a discussion with our with our UK distributor, and and they said that there is no reason why they should not do the revenue that we do in Germany, not in ’26, but in ’27, ’28, ’29. So we need to make big jumps, and for this, we need as well the teams that that can support that.

Bastian Brahe, Analyst: Yeah. K. Thank you. Then on the second question, I’ve noticed the lock two and lock three device, which was on your last slide in q one, disappeared from the slide. I think that was intentional.

So could you talk a little bit about, yeah, if you plan to launch it in ’26 or what happened there?

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: I’ll tell. There’s so many things with unlimited space, and we cannot put everything. The works is on track. Yeah. We’ve seen that maybe they will be released very close to the end of the year, ’25.

Probably from what we know and how we’re doing, the first batch, when it’s coming, it’s not the huge one because we wanna first to be completely proof from the wide range of the customers, which is, for example, a thousand or 5,000 pieces. This will not change our number significantly. So the significant number change expected after that, which definitely is 2026. So it’s removed just to that something else. It’s still there.

It’s still on track. Depends of the you know, it’s so many things, certification or or some additional requirements for the chip supplier, some returning information, feedback from the QA group and external small group of external customers we give us. This could make a delay between three three to six months, for example, just to make the product perfect for the for the other customers. So it’s there? It’s just I don’t It’s just removed from the presentation.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: No. Yeah. Patxiang, you pay you pay a lot of attention in details. That’s Yeah. That’s amazing.

So we have we had already a small delay in the with the current lock because we wanted to sell 4,000 pieces in the last quarter. We did only get two and a half thousand. So they will come later. We see that the supply chain takes longer. It’s a mechanical product, mechanical production that takes longer.

At the same time, we will show at IFA the current lock in a version with only two seconds opening and closing time. So currently, it makes as as a lot of the smart locks, it makes a lot of noise like opening like, and now it will be open, close in two seconds. At the same time, as Dimita said, we need to we need to find some we we need to get the right certification. And the indication currently is that we will get very small quantities this year and significant quantities next year. So that’s why and we have not enough space on the on the chart to put 30 products.

That’s why we took them off. And it’s not something that will be a dead or life question. It’s

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. No. It’s something. Just just imagine that there’s at least 10 products which we hide them and doesn’t share with nobody because the competition, because we wanna keep them as a not as a reserve from the investors, but it’s something which we cannot show everything. This is a lot of direction which you’re working for.

Bastian Brahe, Analyst: Okay. Thank you. Okay. The locked one still is is sold by you, and you are still producing them. Right?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Yes. Same same producer.

Just we we improve the quality. We change the display because that was a weak point that was breaking with the with the old lock that was sold by the company that went in in bankruptcy. We have improved the technology a lot. We have integrated it in the Shelley environment. And now we have the new motor that is much faster and much more silent.

The the current ones that are there are already more silent because the isolation is better. And the next locks that will come, one will be a smaller version of the one that we currently have, and one will be a completely new development. So if we are lucky, we will have some revenues this year. If they are too late and shipment takes long, you cannot fly them. They are too heavy.

So that’s all things that we still have to learn.

Bastian Brahe, Analyst: Okay. That’s it for me. Thank you very much.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. And we switch to some questions from the chat box. I’ll read it out. Is asking, the growth in cloud users is impressive. You have earlier spoken about results from your cloud user survey.

Results were up to 20%. Users said they would consider buying premium subscription. How are you think about long term premium penetration rates?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: That’s a very good question. You know, learning shows that if you ask customers, are you willing to pay for a service? They all say yes. If then it comes to paying for the service, they change their minds. So we are not saying that in the next two years, we will get 20% of our customers converted into premium customers.

That would be too bold. And I repeat myself, if you see the chart, we expect 1,000,000 revenue this year coming from premium application users, 2,500,000 next year. And then what comes after is a bit far away, but I think we should double more or less every year. And that leads then to significant numbers in ’27, ’28 and beyond. And not only significant numbers as well to a significant effect in in results because that is to a huge proportion profit EBIT directly.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. And mister Zindig is adding, the guidance for h two is very aggressive given the current results from h one. Can you maybe remind us on the different criteria critical levers to reach the EBIT target beyond higher margin, new gen products, and the onboarded country team in Poland?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: It’s you can ask.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: I think, yeah, I can ask this. It’s combination. It’s not just one. The first thing is the new markets which we’re opening, especially the pawn team, yep, partially. The the the the the team in United Kingdom which we they’re opening now, definitely, partially.

The new technologies, the new product lines which we’re working on, not as we say, the works or the cameras, the the the especially the the very famous products for the even for existing customers as a power strip and the radar technology, the the the the multi person tracking technology, which we developed into we launched it now. As you’ve seen, the big partially a part of the products is coming the second half of the year, which will help for the revenue. So there is no single stream. There is no single answer for the revenues coming from there. But usually, we know that the second half of the year is stronger.

Also, by the way, from distribution perspective, there is also the logic. Because during the the the the second half of the year when it’s stronger and the new products is coming, and also the the the the the Black Friday events, the special events around the Christmas, people buying lots of devices upfront, which is somehow and also the distributors buying lots of devices upfront, which is somehow affect the second and the first half of the year. For example, we’ve seen a lots of activations in the in the in the January and February in our cloud, but this is not mean sales because sales sales is made two months two months before. And this is somehow related that the the second half of the year, the new products, is the market is much more active. You know, the the for example, the new the the new winter season is coming.

The people start looking again for the how to optimize the energy consumption. Usually, this the the during this time, the energy price is much higher, which is the the there’s the reason to to make more. And the second one is as you’ve seen, what mean 50% activation, 30% more sales? This mean that, really, the our distributors’ warehouse is slowly going to be not empty, but let’s say less with less products, and they will compensate this one on the second half of the year. So there’s explanation, and this is something which we’ve seen for the many many years and quarters ago that happens the same.

Yep.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Nothing to add. And that beside that, we we planned this from the beginning of the year. So if you look to the February presentation, for last year, we already said we expect an an up ramping growth rate, so higher percentages quarter over quarter coming mainly from new products and coming from onboarding of countries and or the result of people that have been onboarded before already. So we see a very good development in Italy, for example, and we will see the first results in Poland. We will see the real effect in Poland next year.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: And as a follow-up on the consumer behavior, do you see any higher likelihood for consumers to buy cloud premium if they purchase newer generation products or certain product lines?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: I would I I didn’t check it. I don’t know if Demeter checked it.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: I think no. I don’t let’s say for the premium customers, as we thought many times, this is not our main target. We we offering them a a better deals. We’re the services which we offer to the premium customers, but this is currently still is not our main target. We we it’s so about but about the new products in generation four pro for products, it’s too early to say because I will tell, for example, for generation four, with this motor, Zigbee, and everything certification, we have, for example, significant delay for two PM gen four.

It’s it’s ready for production in March. It’s the the and from March to beginning of the, I think, June, we’re waiting to be certified because this is the first product, the matter product, which have a dual dual profiles. I mean, this is can act as a two way relay with a power measurement or cover control, the roller shutter control. So this does not exist, and we we need We need to talk.

We need to discuss how this can be done. They need to change their own procedure. And all of these times, the process ready in our warehouse just ready to be to be, yeah, distributed to to to our channels, but and awaiting this to be solved. So sometimes to be much more advanced, innovative, and going much faster than the market and the thinking for the other other certification organization people, this is his this this this this might have headache for us because and and, again, there are some delays. So that’s that’s a lot of the difference which we do a lot of the things which we do.

So it’s clearly we cannot say this or that because it’s affected not only just for the we have everything on stock and everybody can buy us as he want. No. Sometimes it happens that they buy what we have, not what we know, what what what they want.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Thanks. And can you elaborate on you what you think about how the partnership with Echoflow is going and your reasoning around the two chosen products?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: It’s it’s say it again. I I really missed the question.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. I lose the question.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Can can you elaborate on you think about how the partnership with Ecoflow is going and your reasoning around the two chosen products?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. Very well. And the reasoning is very simple. One product is the is the is the entry product that they use for balcony power stations, and the second product is the is the high end product that they use for bigger systems. And the relationship goes very well.

They are very happy with with us. We are working on a lot of joint marketing activities, and we have a co branded product. That’s the first time we did that. As I said, we expect in the next months, quarters, others to come to ask for the same, and that’s, of course, that’s always a question of quantities. We will not do this with everyone with for small quantities only if it makes really sense for us.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: But also, I wanna add that you should not expect to share any kind of details related to the how much is the revenue from Mako for what exactly we are doing this completely. We are not able to be able to to share, and we will not do that.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. And we move to participants on the audio line. Mr. Hovwald, you should be able to speak now and place your question.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. Good morning. What is it that Amazon wants and you’re not conceding? And what are the consequences that you’re basically suffering? Not okay to hear me.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: I I I try to answer. I I have to be a little bit careful because I’m not sure if Amazon is not listening in this call. Or later. So what are what are they doing? Amazon usually says that they take the price of a product as it is in the market.

They don’t wanna be more aggressive. They don’t wanna be more expensive. But, of course, they pick the ones in the market that they choose. So if someone not relevant in the market makes a very aggressive price, they take this as their price. With this, this price is super visible in the market.

Other retailers say, oh, Amazon is on that price. I have to go down in the price. Then Amazon says, ah, if I were on a promotion, I need to be cheaper than the others, and the the supplier has to compensate that. No problem with that. We can do that because they sell significant quantities.

So you give them €1 more for a product, you expect that they go €1 down with the promotion price, they go 2 or €3 down. And afterwards, they tell you the reason is they found someone who was more aggressive in the market, that’s why they had to go down more, and they ask you for more compensations. And then we say, no. We will not give you more compensations. And this is a circle that is never ending.

So we had a conversation with the guys asking why they put one of our products at a super low price. They said we just matched the competition, and then I asked which competitor. They could not answer or they didn’t want to answer. And one one typical significant thing is one of our most sold products, that’s the the the professional power meter, that is sold in Germany by law without VAT if you use it together with the solar system. Amazon cannot show prices without VAT.

So they match the price of competition that sells the product without VAT, and they include VAT, and they ask us for 19% compensation. And I could continue now one hour or more to talk about examples like this, and we are refusing. And then they start to be angry, and then they threaten you. They say, ah, we will do this. We will return products, and we say, okay.

Return products. So we know that they sold more than than to their to end users than we sold to them. We know that they are completely sold out. They try to find products on the market. That’s a nice power game, and we are not willing to to to say yes to everyone, to to everything that Amazon wants, and paying a price in a sense of negative impact on other channels later on.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. Thank you.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Well, thank you very much for placing your question. I’ll get back to the chat box reading out a question from mister Tussaud regarding your June 17 press release stating that Shelley Group is on track to register over 10,000,000 new devices in 2025. Assuming an average price of €20 per device, does this imply potential revenues of around €200,000,000 for the year? I assume that’s not the case for 2025. So I would like to know how should we interpret this projection in terms of revenue impact.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: But we did not release that we plan an average price of €20. The average price is lower than €20.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yeah.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: So that’s a

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: quick answer to that. Yeah.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: I know. Maybe end user price is, but we doesn’t sell directly to end users. The the the over 90% is coming through the wholesalers, and they’re buying in the different prices.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yes. The big and the big volumes are products that are sold at €11, €12, €10. Yeah. So now if we plan 12 to 13,000,000 devices this year with a bit more than €10, it leads to 150,000,000. That’s our Yeah.

Simple mathematics.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Okay. Thank you. And there’s a participant on the audio line, mister Khan Dusseff. You should be able to speak now. Hello?

You should be able to speak now. Well, then we switch back to some questions from the chat box. Well, then let me see. Yes. So what is the revenue split and unit split between pro and do it yourself devices?

Do the professional installers use mostly pro series, or do they use both?

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Okay. I will not answer this question because this this is matter. The internal information. We don’t we don’t want to share with nobody this one because can be used from the from the competitors. Something I wanna add because I’ve seen that there’s some doubt from the what about Amazon, what this is happening, this one.

I just wanna tell you there is no other company worldwide, even in Europe, which can completely kick out the biggest old online retailer and stop selling to them and keep growing because this is nothing happens. Just nothing happens. So this is showing the two things. The first, we we’re not dependent of the channel. The people don’t buy because we are present in the in the in the Amazon or we’re present in the in the, I don’t some retail chain in Germany, the people looking for devices to buy them from anywhere.

They need our devices. They don’t care who’s selling these our devices. So the the the some it’s not the first time when some resellers try to push and to tell us if it’s not me, you cannot do the business. No. This is completely different.

The the the the and also this channel, they doesn’t develop the market. We develop the market. And the people asking, working for our devices. This is some reason, for example, which we which we have with such kind of resellers, the the the how to say, the they tell us, okay. Give me give me 50 or 20 additional percent for the marketing because we will promote our devices.

How we promote our devices? We very good know that if somebody coming, no matter that could be Google, Amazon, they don’t looking for the smart relay for the curtains. They’re looking for the Shelly one or they’re looking for the Shelly two PM exact device. And sorry, but to pay for this one to somebody because just they showing the numbers, not not recommending. They’re showing our devices.

This is ridiculous. So but but this is really proven, and believe me, there is no brand which can just for a half of the year, I think most of this happened in the second quarter, to kick out completely one China everything to to one huge distribute distributor to to stop. Let’s say, not kick out, but to limiting the work most as possible to someone and then to continue successfully growing as never as nothing happens. I think this is most important to looking for them what in what happens and when. We know that we can live without them.

They can live without us. I’m sure that not now, maybe in the future, we will make another big, huge cooperation, then we can lay then we can work together. On the same time, we’re completely successful with Amazon team for what how how is called this team for the connected environment. This is the

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Oh, yeah. Yeah. The Alexa team.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. Alexa team with the connected Smart properties. Smart properties team. We on a weekly base, we have a call with them. A lot of the hotels now in the Europe, they the Amazon negotiating with them to to to implement their own technology using our devices, especially in Italy.

The two big companies, and now the I cannot share the details. The one the big chain of the hotels using our device was not fine, but is fine by the the the Amazon team, the Alexa property team. And also a lot of the a lot of the projects connect with the elderly living, which is driving from Amazon Amazon. They’re working with us. So this is the completely different direction in the businesses, but I think it’s that’s something which I just wanna add.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. I I think that’s to to to finally answer the question because this was about pro and not pro share. As Simita said, we are not disclosing individual product lines. If you ask if installers are installing more pro devices than other devices, I would say, in general, no. Because installers install what what the customer wants.

And if it’s installed behind the wall switch, that’s not a pro device. If it’s installed in in the central distribution box, it’s a it’s a pro device. And I would say that most of our customers are able to install something behind the wall switch. Not all of them and not that much of the do it yourself customers go to the central distribution box where they have three phases and where it’s more dangerous. So that means more of our pro devices are installed by an installer, but the other way around, the installer is as well installing the small devices everywhere.

And and and rising. And we see that that I said it at the very beginning of the day today, the the number of installers that are joining our network, it’s it’s rocket rocketing, and it’s it’s accelerating every day.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. And there’s a another question. What will be the revenue potential for the energy contract segment?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Too early to say. Yeah. Is this revenue 200 to

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: two b.

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Revenue revenue will be very low because it will be more a commission based business, so it will have an EBIT effect. But it’s it’s really too early to say. We could we of course, we have some internal calculation, but whatever we say here is is leading to a wrong direction.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Okay. And there is one question in detail. Can you clarify the problem with the Seattle based ecommerce player? It sounded like the demand of products, Is it that you can’t meet with the production to both their needs or and other resellers?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: I think I think we have answered that.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yes. Absolutely.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. Okay. So then we move on. What kind of effects will the lower dollar have on the margins in the longer term?

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: If the dollar stays on that level, it will increase our margins because the components are depending on the dollar. And if the dollar is 10% cheaper and we buy our products 10% cheaper, we bring them to Europe, convert this in euros because we make most of the revenue in euros, that will have a positive effect on the margin. So in theory, if the dollar is 10% cheaper and we buy all products 10% cheaper, which is not the case because there are things that are not dollar affected, that would have a positive margin effect of three, four, 5%. It will not be that much. It’s just like in theory, 10% exchange rate advantage or lower component price advantage leads to with 50% gross margin leads to or 55% gross margin leads to 3%, 4% better gross margin for us.

So it will be it will have a positive effect in the mid and maybe long term because, of course, we are securing now components at a lower price in case the dollar goes up again, that we are on the safe side to have these components on board and can take profit from this for a longer time.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. And we move on to a question from our chat box. Could you give us any more color about the planned fabrication in Bulgaria as mister Dimitrov said in an interview early on?

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: I can update with this one. I think it’s going contract now. I think the this year or this week or next week, we’re finishing the tender to choose a supplier of the machinery, which we need for for the line. The building is under preparation. It’s going okay.

I think I just approved the the the air conditioner system, which which need to be installed. So it’s going okay. We’re expecting the first queue of the next year, the line to be ready, but we don’t expect immediately this wine to start generating revenue. We go and to be to have a significant effect. It’s take a time.

We will take additional maybe one or two quarters before we move some production. We increase the production capacity. As you know, as a company, we’re not make risky moves, and we we we make everything much careful. Even sometimes against the revenue and the results, we prefer the safety way.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Thank you. And is there any expectance to open to new customer groups, for example, not technical consumers with a new Matter possibility? Are there already percentage how many Shelley consumers are using the Matter standard?

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Very low numbers. Let’s say the Matter standard is used is not only for us. This is the market feedback. The market is the the matter is suffering, and the customer still doesn’t choose it because the limitation is not so easy to as they advertise to to use the devices the first time. The second time the second a huge problem is that Matter now is the version 1.4.

1.45 means some version like that. Still, the big companies like Google, Apple, and Amazon, they their controllers, the Matterhub, they support 1.1. I 1.2, some of them. Only one or two support 1.2. I mean, this is the this is going far from they they they they following, but very very slow the the the new the new protocol upgrades for the matter.

When and limitation of the customer, what they can do with devices, especially for energy management, for example, they cannot do anything. They can just monitor the current the current energy, but nothing else. And with other things, we’ve seen that the matter the the matter hype is a little bit go away. We will see what happens next year and how we support it. We will decide and when we see, we decide for generation five or six in the future, do we wanna support it, or we will keep the wine, which is only the matter of wine for the customers, which is only one, and and if it is this is deserve.

But nothing. Let’s say, for me, when we work is the something below 5% of the customers which are activating devices is some other enabled. Some of them, we see that enabled, and after that, immediately disable it. So they’re still using our application. And the native integration with the Google, with the SmartThings, with the Home Assistant, with with the Alexa, but they don’t want they because yeah.

By the way, Matter doesn’t give them nothing on top

Wolfgang Kirsch, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: of moment. So Matter will not, from our current point of view, will not be the big driver into the the wide market of smart home. But to to to reach this this customer, this this target group, I mean, the not technical savvy people, that’s why we are pushing the installer program because that’s the guys that need installation, technical installation. And we have installer portals now, we make it easier for the installers to access the customer’s account. And all this is something that is driving the market much more than Meta.

Just a very simple comparison because I’m using, of course, the Shelley products at home with the Shelley application. And to make it easier for others, my wife, I said, well, let’s try to use Apple Apple HomeKit. And I can tell you it’s it’s very, very limited. It’s easy to integrate, but you can switch on, you can switch off. But if you wanna connect your light switch with a with a motion sensor, simply impossible.

Doesn’t work. If you wanna have the information about energy consumption, doesn’t work. So that’s very limited, and that’s I think that supports exactly what Dimitra just said. People try it out, then they switch back because it doesn’t make any sense. It’s a big marketing deck.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. Thank you very much. And in the meantime, we just received one last question in our chat box. Will there be a new TRV before the heating season?

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Nope. No. The existing one is working well. The customers is very happy with the with the with the Bluetooth one which we’re working on. We think it can for the very beginning, can be the one a really huge company to have, again, the the the to to to develop the, again, the Wi Fi version.

But let’s say the technology, when we test, still a little bit to be aged, is is not enough proof. So we keep the existing one with the Bluetooth one, and we’ve seen the really very positive feedback from the Bluetooth one and to keep it like that for the next season.

Moderator, Shelley Group SE: Great. And that’s everything with the questions. We just finished the last ones in our chat box, and there’s no one with a question on the audio line. So I’ll wait a few seconds if there is someone using the chance to talk to you guys. Well, it’s not the case.

Seems everything is clear. So thank you for joining. We come to the end of today’s earnings call. Should further questions arise at a later time, please feel free to contact Investor Relations. Thank you to you both for the presentation and the time you took to answer the questions.

I wish you all a lovely remaining Friday. And for some final remarks, I hand over to mister Dimitrov.

Dimitar Dimitrov, Co-CEO, Shelley Group SE: Yeah. Thank you very much. As I as I said before, I think at the moment, we are on the on the speed growth, and the company is in is very good shape and conditions. We believe that we can surprise the the the customers with our new lines and device, also the investors with the results also in the future. Thank you one more time for the trust, and have a good day for everybody.

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